Flexi investment...

[Stan B]

I'm a big Flexi Fan. After wokring for a while in it, Corel looks like joke. Adobe CS package is a must have no matter wich other sign making software you will choose.

 

[SignsRus]

That's pretty far fetched. I have Corel X3, Illy and photoshop Cs2, Flexi 8.0 and Freehand.

You COULD get by with any of these packs by themselves. I prefer having all at my fingertips, but do 98% of my work in Corel/ Flexi. Illustrator has been getting dusty, and I just use photoshop for oddball special effects for raster images.

It's all up to what you're comfy with, but by no means is any adobe product a "must have" IMO.

I couldn't imagine not having a copy of photoshop or illustrator. You get what you pay for. Corel is so-so software, and that's why it costs what it does

TBH though. I've had copies of photoshop and illustrator since version 3 or so. So growing up having them both does make it kind of hard to be without them.

We have copies of Corel, and I know people that love it. It just has it's limitations. I mean honestly. Can you name something you couldn't do when you have both Photoshop & Illustrator?

 

[synergy_jim]

I know that there are many Flexi fans out there, I'm just not one of them. I prefer Corel X3, coupled with CoCut Pro for vinyl cutting and Wasatch SoftRIP for printing.

I also have Adobe CS2 suite, but I'm very inexperienced with them and really don't care for how they 'work'. I know Adobe may be more 'standard', but I hate how you have to zoom in them. What no friggin' wheel-mouse support? How archane is that? I love how the zoom works in Corel...wherever the mouse is and you wheel-mouse, that is the center of the zoom...very handy IMHO. Why don't the Adobe apps have something even similar...the 'CTRL +' and 'CTRL -' is so stupid to me!

My wheel mouse works fine in illustrator. Maybe you need to check some mouse settings.

hold alt key and move the mouse wheel to scroll in and out....

any other illustrator help you need let me know...

I have a nifty desktop wallpaper made up of pshop and illy shortcuts you might find useful

JD

 

[Techman]

Corel is so-so software, and that's why it costs what it does

Well now. the tens of thousands of Corel users will completly disagree. I and many others find Illustrator a less than adequate program because of its difficulty. Then the tutors around the web are not fully informative either. They have to many gaps that assumes the user has some knowledge adn leaves the user hanging as to what the next step should be. Too many tutorials cannot be duplicated by the user.

Corel and Cocut pro has made me money for years. This combo does every thing i have ever needed. There is nothing I cannot do with Corel that someone else can do in flexi.

And then Cocut pro will work with Illy and Autocad as well. So then you have THREE options for cutting.

There is no need whatsoever to spend over $700 for a complete cutting package. None.

And finaly. Corel Draw is not a Desk top publishing program. Corel is a Vector construction program. It happens that it has plugins such as cocut pro that allow it to do so much more. Corel Ventura is their desk top publisher.

 

[SignsRus]

Well now. the tens of thousands of Corel users will completly disagree. I and many others find Illustrator a less than adequate program because of its difficulty. Then the tutors around the web are not fully informative either. They have to many gaps that assumes the user has some knowledge adn leaves the user hanging as to what the next step should be. Too many tutorials cannot be duplicated by the user.

Corel and Cocut pro has made me money for years. This combo does every thing i have ever needed. There is nothing I cannot do with Corel that someone else can do in flexi.

And then Cocut pro will work with Illy and Autocad as well. So then you have THREE options for cutting.

There is no need whatsoever to spend over $700 for a complete cutting package. None.

And finaly. Corel Draw is not a Desk top publishing program. Corel is a Vector construction program. It happens that it has plugins such as cocut pro that allow it to do so much more. Corel Ventura is their desk top publisher.

TOUCHE

 

[Fred Weiss]

I've been a Flexi user since 1995 and still am. I also use Gerber Omega, Adobe Photoshop, Adobe Illustrator, Corel X3 in that order of preference.

Unlike most of the Flexi comments, I use it primarily for design and vector creation and editing. To me it is like Illustrator on steroids and has, IMHO, the best vector path cleanup tools of anything out there.

OTOH, I'm not at all sure I would recommend to most people getting into the business that they start with Flexi, Omega or SignLab. It's smarter to grow into what you will need and pay for it from profits ... even if generated in a less efficient manner.

 

[Rick]

I'm a hardcore Illy user but openly admit CorelDraw is an equal program in it's abilities...it's like saying my pencil is better....just depends on who is pushing it around. No point in saying what is better...but what is better for you.....

Having worked at a few shops, I put together all the shops idea of workflow..since I do more than just signage, designing in Illy then sending it to Flexi makes sense..or desiging a sign package and sending it out too bid or print work.....it's about your workflow....almost all the shops I have worked for designed in Illy or Corel, and sent it to a sign program for production.

 

[thewood]

Unlike most of the Flexi comments, I use it primarily for design and vector creation and editing. To me it is like Illustrator on steroids and has, IMHO, the best vector path cleanup tools of anything out there.

Finally, a voice of reason in the wilderness.

 

[Jackpine]

Sign-Lab, Ciber Cut, Co-Cut, ect.

I agree with Chris, except for CoCut. I just didn't like COCut. Do get CorelX3 if you don't have it yet.
Signlab would be my first choice for a cutting program.

 

[Bogie]

Are you looking to print/cut, or just to cut?

Print/Cut, then I could see getting Cocut or Flexi... (and you likely don't need the full-blown version of Flexi either - but your dealer WILL sell it it you...).

If you're just cutting, try the stuff that comes with the plotter. If the 7000 is ANYTHING like my 5000, the cutter manager program was written by the SAI/Flexi folks.

Personally, I just went with this because I'm doing print/cut, and my printer came with an SAI product that I _had_ to upgrade to get the print/cut stuff to work.

 

[Steve G.]

Just another two cents, not any arguments, i personally don't care what anyone else uses, but I like Flexi also.
I learned to design on Corel, used it for for four years, then added flexi when i bought my first plotter. I prefer flexi for Vector drawing and editing and use corel and photo shop for my print design. Flexi has a big part in my shop still, i have it on three stations.
Just wanted to throw that out there so you know that some people Don't think that flexi is Garbage or useless. It is a tool like any other. I love it for some things. I also love corel, photo shop and Illustrator for other things and use them all.
Software is personal, so take it for what it's worth.

steve

 

[Michael]

I have been creating vectors for years on Corel, I heard someone say something about easier node cleanup?...this is something I don't know about but would love to see for myself! I have never had any problems creating smooth vectors with Corel with very few nodes to slow the path of the cutter, I came to these boards to learn and I am hoping someone could explain how it has an easier cleanup please.

 

[Fred Weiss]

I have been creating vectors for years on Corel, I heard someone say something about easier node cleanup?...this is something I don't know about but would love to see for myself! I have never had any problems creating smooth vectors with Corel with very few nodes to slow the path of the cutter, I came to these boards to learn and I am hoping someone could explain how it has an easier cleanup please.

To fully explain would require a couple of dozen posts. Let me attempt to summarize my opinions:

Global approaches to vectorizing and subsequent path cleanup are generally inferior to either hand tracing or manual cleanup of autotraced vectors. The trick, therefore, is to provide efficient ways to inject myself as an artist and a technician into either of the preferred manual processes.

In the attachments below, I have created a 7 point glitch on a circle. My objective is to eliminate the glitch cleanly and accurately without changing anything with the balance of the vector. To do this I would first duplicate the vector and make it a guide to make sure I stay true to the original unless I feel artistically that something different should be the case.

Now let's count the steps to correct the glitch in Flexi.

1. Select the Optimize by Curve tool.
2. Click the path at Point A to set the start of where I will be optimizing.
3. Click the path at Point B to set the end of where I will be optimizing.
4. Inspect the proposed change that the tool will perform and, if okay, click the check mark on Design Central to execute the command. Basically the Point A and B selections are setting new points on the adjoining segments that pickup the angle and length required to retain the existing paths and to remove all nodes inbetween the points.

I'm done. Last time I looked in Corel or Illustrator I would have to:

1. Select the Node Edit or Direct Select tool.
2. Marquee select the nodes I want to delete.
3. Delete the selected nodes.
4. Adjust the control arm on remaining bottom node.
5. Adjust the control arm on remaining top node.
6. Hope I got it right and didn't change anything on any adjoining path segments.

Multiply this by dozens or even hundreds of similar edits and a significant difference emerges in both time and accuracy.

 

[schurms]

For raster images Photoshop, vector is a horse a piece. You guys in the sign industry have to understand...................Flexi does not exist in any other part of the industry except signs. Get the drift...........Get Ciberprint for a rip. So much money is wasted in this sign industry on stupid stuff and Flexi is ripping all you off

 

[thewood]

For raster images Photoshop, vector is a horse a piece. You guys in the sign industry have to understand...................Flexi does not exist in any other part of the industry except signs. Get the drift...........Get Ciberprint for a rip. So much money is wasted in this sign industry on stupid stuff and Flexi is ripping all you off

Well, schurms, from what I can decipher from you broken English, Flexi is ripping off all us "guys in the sign industry." Of course, you're getting screwed, too, since you have Flexi listed in your profile. Also, it was only a few months ago that you started this thread asking what the best RIP was:

http://signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19245

So, what, you're an expert now? Also, what does "vector is a horse a piece" mean? Really.

 

[The Big Squeegee]

I've used Vinyl Master Pro and it is a very easy program to learn. It's on ebay for less than $200. Design and cut from the same software.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Signmakers-RIP-...0208376QQihZ002QQcategoryZ46740QQcmdZViewItem

 

[schurms]

I have Flexi starter for my plotter, $79. Never would I spend $3500 for a Pro version or a latest and greatest version.

 

[Michael]

To fully explain would require a couple of dozen posts. Let me attempt to summarize my opinions:

Global approaches to vectorizing and subsequent path cleanup are generally inferior to either hand tracing or manual cleanup of autotraced vectors. The trick, therefore, is to provide efficient ways to inject myself as an artist and a technician into either of the preferred manual processes.

In the attachments below, I have created a 7 point glitch on a circle. My objective is to eliminate the glitch cleanly and accurately without changing anything with the balance of the vector. To do this I would first duplicate the vector and make it a guide to make sure I stay true to the original unless I feel artistically that something different should be the case.

Now let's count the steps to correct the glitch in Flexi.

1. Select the Optimize by Curve tool.
2. Click the path at Point A to set the start of where I will be optimizing.
3. Click the path at Point B to set the end of where I will be optimizing.
4. Inspect the proposed change that the tool will perform and, if okay, click the check mark on Design Central to execute the command. Basically the Point A and B selections are setting new points on the adjoining segments that pickup the angle and length required to retain the existing paths and to remove all nodes inbetween the points.

I'm done. Last time I looked in Corel or Illustrator I would have to:

1. Select the Node Edit or Direct Select tool.
2. Marquee select the nodes I want to delete.
3. Delete the selected nodes.
4. Adjust the control arm on remaining bottom node.
5. Adjust the control arm on remaining top node.
6. Hope I got it right and didn't change anything on any adjoining path segments.

Multiply this by dozens or even hundreds of similar edits and a significant difference emerges in both time and accuracy.

In Corel I would select the shape tool and delete the 5 middle nodes and done.

 

[Sign-Man Signs]

Like Fred, I use Flexi most of the time. Just faster than Corel. To many hoops to jump through in Corel. I have all the software out there but I use Flexi 90% of the time just because it's faster. Just starting out, I'd buy Corel just because of the price difference. Both will do you a good job, but a different learning curve for both.

 

[Michael]

Now to take it one step further I can just go to shape tool, select all nodes and reduce nodes to four nodes creating even less nodes than your five, bringing it down to one if I choose.