Health Care Exchange

[bob]

I don't fully understand the issue but it seems a rich country like yours could provide basic healthcare to those who need it.
I'm clearly missing something.

The ability to do something is not justification for doing it. Health care is a commodity, you can have as much of it as you can pay for. The amount you can have depends on how much you can afford. Just like any other commodity.

You can choose to join a health care collective if you desire. Likewise you can go it alone if that's your choice.

Can't afford healthcare? You probably should have made better decisions in your life. If you expect others to pick up the tab for your health care then first please explain how it is that the results of your choices in life somehow constitute a mortgage on the lives of others

Any and all justifications for picking up the tabs of others seen to date are invariably the result of convoluted rationalizations and painfully tortured reasoning. What do you suppose the odds are that you or anyone else will present anything different?

As for myself, my lack of interest in summoning up any part of my life and/or my resources in order to pay for anything, absolutely anything, for someone else by order of whatever squad of morons happens to be in charge at the moment is total. If I participate in charity it's because AND ONLY BECAUSE I have chosen to do so. There is no other reason that is acceptable.

 

[fresh]

I don't fully understand the issue but it seems a rich country like yours could provide basic healthcare to those who need it.
I'm clearly missing something.

You and me both bucko. The USA is really, truly screwed up politically and financially. We have a small group of ultra rich controlling the government, media, and our bodies. They are really smart, too, because they are able to incite fear in large populations who would otherwise be considered intelligent and considerate. Now instead of thinking like rational, compassionate human beings, they all complain and cry about government regulations. You know what they don't do? Anything that makes any difference to anyone. Its all lip-service.

 

[Gino]

You and me both bucko. The USA is really, truly screwed up politically and financially. We have a small group of ultra rich controlling the government, media, and our bodies. They are really smart, too, because they are able to incite fear in large populations who would otherwise be considered intelligent and considerate. Now instead of thinking like rational, compassionate human beings, they all complain and cry about government regulations. You know what they don't do? Anything that makes any difference to anyone. Its all lip-service.

And this kind of BS is what will get this thread locked down. Please...... please...... keep your political views to yourself regardless of anyone agreeing with you or not.

This thread is about HealthCare and how to deal with it as is. Not the political baggage that goes along with it.

Can we all agree to discuss what's at hand without going off on nonsense ?? This is not the other section any longer.

 

[brush1]

I don't fully understand the issue but it seems a rich country like yours could provide basic healthcare to those who need it.
I'm clearly missing something.

You are not.
I came to USA from Europe....16 years ago.

I will be happy to pay more taxes and feel safe.

Here they will take you to the hospital when life is in danger....and kick you out as fast as they can....forget about to see the doctor if you are not in life treatning situation and you can't afford insurance.

Will retired in Europe.

 

[ddarlak]

And this kind of BS is what will get this thread locked down. Please...... please...... keep your political views to yourself regardless of anyone agreeing with you or not.

this thread cannot be locked down, healthcare premiums are a business expense, this is a business topic.

if someone goes off and gets all political, i'm quite sure the authority will simply remove the offending post instead of the entire thread....






lol

 

[ddarlak]

Got in, was halfway thru the verification process and was booted again....

 

[Mosh]

I have insure through my wife's employer so doesn't apply to me but....
Forcing poor people to pay for insurance, they will only be able to afford the ones with $5,000 and up deductibles so bacially that insurance won't kick in until they pay the first $5,000....so pretty much poor people still won't be able to afford a doctor visit....

 

[David Wright]

I have insure through my wife's employer so doesn't apply to me but....
Forcing poor people to pay for insurance, they will only be able to afford the ones with $5,000 and up deductibles so bacially that insurance won't kick in until they pay the first $5,000....so pretty much poor people still won't be able to afford a doctor visit....

You didn't think they were going to fix the problems they said were addressing did you?

 

[ddarlak]

I have insure through my wife's employer so doesn't apply to me but....
Forcing poor people to pay for insurance, they will only be able to afford the ones with $5,000 and up deductibles so bacially that insurance won't kick in until they pay the first $5,000....so pretty much poor people still won't be able to afford a doctor visit....

the object of health insurance isn't to cover the cost of a doctors visit, it's to cover the heart attack, car accident, cancer type healthcare crisis that can cost 10's of thousands

a 'poor' person is going to get treatment one way or another, this new system is to infuse more cash into the barrel so we can live our last remaining years as a science project for some cancer doctor...

 

[Mosh]

I went to the doctor for Hay Fever, I get allergies bad around harvest time all the grain dust...without insurace that doctor visit and the meds would have been $750, with insurance my co-pay was $20 for the doc and $35 for the meds, so tell me insurance isn't worth having for just a doctor visit.
BUT the cheap insurance won't do this!!! They would have to fork out the whole $750, so I bet they wouldn't just go in the first place.

 

[artbot]

this is the failure of the argument. if massive unpaid healthcare bills are the issue then we should all be required to at least have a high deductible catastrophic policy. that is what most insurance policies are for (fire, auto, etc.)... financially catastrophic bills.

we don't pay home insurance and then require a claim when we need a new gutter or patch a driveway. the same should go for the ACA. below the "bronze plan" should be an "iron plan" that costs about $50 a month with a $15,000 deductible. we'd all know then that we weren't going to die of cancer or bleed out on a hospital sidewalk.

as for requiring businesses to cover employees. that makes no sense. we can't have the government forcing companies to handle employees personal affairs. they can choose to, but it shouldn't be a law. just because you employ people doesn't make you that employee's "provider of all things".

healthcare is not a right any more than food or clothing or shelter or an college education is. until the non income tax paying other half of this country starts paying income tax politicians will forever be in this never ending cycle of buying votes one entitlement at a time.

 

[SignManiac]

this is the failure of the argument. if massive unpaid healthcare bills are the issue then we should all be required to at least have a high deductible catastrophic policy. that is what most insurance policies are for (fire, auto, etc.)... financially catastrophic bills.

we don't pay home insurance and then require a claim when we need a new gutter or patch a driveway. the same should go for the ACA. below the "bronze plan" should be an "iron plan" that costs about $50 a month with a $15,000 deductible. we'd all know then that we weren't going to die of cancer or bleed out on a hospital sidewalk.

as for requiring businesses to cover employees. that makes no sense. we can't have the government forcing companies to handle employees personal affairs. they can choose to, but it shouldn't be a law. just because you employ people doesn't make you that employee's "provider of all things".

healthcare is not a right any more than food or clothing or shelter or an college education is. until the non income tax paying other half of this country starts paying income tax politicians will forever be in this never ending cycle of buying votes one entitlement at a time.

+11111

 

[Mosh]

My family of 4 would be $850 for the coverage we have from the State, my wife is a teacher.

 

[royster13]

So why do many of you US folks think the Canadian system is so bad?????

 

[ddarlak]

I went to the doctor for Hay Fever, I get allergies bad around harvest time all the grain dust...without insurace that doctor visit and the meds would have been $750, with insurance my co-pay was $20 for the doc and $35 for the meds, so tell me insurance isn't worth having for just a doctor visit.
BUT the cheap insurance won't do this!!! They would have to fork out the whole $750, so I bet they wouldn't just go in the first place.

i was being sarcastic, as I have been using the plan artbot speaks of for the last 7 years, yet my $11,000 deductable plan is still $607 a month....well it was, i bet it'll be $800 a month this year...

and artbot, the NY Exchange version of the ACA has a catastrophic plan, but only if you 30 or younger...

 

[ddarlak]

So why do many of you US folks think the Canadian system is so bad?????

because you use loonies....

:snarky

 

[royster13]

because you use loonies....

And "Toonies" to pay for my C$120.50 a month in premiums with No deductible, No lifetime cap and No denials for "Pre Existing Conditions"....

 

[Mosh]

You make that up in taxes.....

 

[brush1]

And "Toonies" to pay for my C$120.50 a month in premiums with No deductible, No lifetime cap and No denials for "Pre Existing Conditions"....

That's why my son (diabetes type 1, with PHD almost free education - scholarships for to be very good student) and his wife (PHD - US government pay for education) are moving to Canada....so this country is loosing high educated people.
Canada love to have them.

 

[royster13]

You make that up in taxes.....

Yes our taxes are higher but not by that much...."Rich" Americans are better off than "Rich" Canadians but average and poor folks are generally better off in Canada....If you are making mortgage payments it gets skewed a bit in your favour as your income gets higher....