Hp latex 360 printer

[ProWraps]

while this may be true about all thermal inket printers its undeniably more pronounced with the hp latex printers.

i have run both solvent and latex, and this issue was no where near the case with solvent printers. hps wont print the same from one end of the panel to the other sometimes let along panel to panel, minute to minute, or day to day. they are getting better. but some days, and some colors, they are an absolute disaster. if it werent for the ability to lam instantly, i would have ditched them long ago.

i appreciate your video links. i will watch them to see if there is something i havent already done.

Of course HP knows that issue, because it is due to design, any thermal inkjet printers have that problem since the beginning.

But there are workarounds, and HP explains them:

[video=youtube;u2vmmeZ9DjY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2vmmeZ9DjY&list=PLsEgsF8P0nXF0QzWs2UX5Vyj F7p1I516I[/video]

[video=youtube;nGJL66Kvy6s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGJL66Kvy6s[/video]



As mentioned before, that problem exists since the first color designjets, and is due to design. With the new heads, they have reduced the overall heat of the heads, so the prints should be more color consistent than with the older models. Bot not perfect too.

Most of our customers live with that, because of the advantages a Latex 300 have to offer (quality, speed, scratch resistance and so on).

 

[dypinc]

That's what we had before. Never profiled anything, loaded all kinds of material and used the same profile on everything. No problems at all with banding, no problems getting good reds or blues. I still haven't been able to achieve good reds or blues with the HP.

There is nothing wrong with the HP when comes achieve good reds or blues. It just takes the proper ink density, calibration/linearization and a good profile.

 

[dypinc]

while this may be true about all thermal inket printers its undeniably more pronounced with the hp latex printers.

i have run both solvent and latex, and this issue was no where near the case with solvent printers. hps wont print the same from one end of the panel to the other sometimes let along panel to panel, minute to minute, or day to day. they are getting better. but some days, and some colors, they are an absolute disaster. if it werent for the ability to lam instantly, i would have ditched them long ago.

i appreciate your video links. i will watch them to see if there is something i havent already done.

How many passes are you using?

Are you using lc/lm inks?

If less than 12 pass and using lc/lm inks what is your inter-pass delay setting?

 

[ProWraps]

we print at 10 pass and use all 6 inks. im not sure of the last setting you asked for. if we go to a 12 pass, we would be outputting a very slow process and would negate the speed of the printer. these printers shouldnt have to be slown down to 12 passes to print properly. i hope

 

[dypinc]

we print at 10 pass and use all 6 inks. im not sure of the last setting you asked for. if we go to a 12 pass, we would be outputting a very slow process and would negate the speed of the printer. these printers shouldnt have to be slown down to 12 passes to print properly. i hope

Since the L3xx only uses one lc/lm printhead and if the job is using a lot of the light inks you probably are getting ink starvation of the light inks especially with faster passes. Setting inter-pass delay to 200ms will not have any real noticeable effect on speed but it may be just enough to let the lc/lm inks catch up to the output.

Having only one lc/lm printhead is becoming a pretty obvious design error at this point especially when using those inks on jobs that use a lot of light inks with 10 pass or lower. I have been told by an HP tech that they could not put another printhead in because it would be to close to the optimizer head. Something about the closeness was causing problems with the optimizer. So HP just decides to take one lc/lm head out and now we see more color inconsistency than ever before. Less lc/lm ink nozzle redundancy does not help either.

 

[ProWraps]

i would have to agree its definately a part of the problem. i know the last firmware .10 they release was specifically created to deal with an issue with the lc/lm from what hp has told us. so obviously something isnt right. i was wondering when i bought these why they killed half of the lc/lm.

do you think taking it back to a cmyk mode and eliminating the lc/lm all together at 10 pass would yield better results?

 

[dypinc]

i would have to agree its definately a part of the problem. i know the last firmware .10 they release was specifically created to deal with an issue with the lc/lm from what hp has told us. so obviously something isnt right. i was wondering when i bought these why they killed half of the lc/lm.

do you think taking it back to a cmyk mode and eliminating the lc/lm all together at 10 pass would yield better results?

I have been trying that with jobs that don't really need the light inks. Still a little bit to early to say but in theory it should help eliminate color inconsistencies. One thing I am still testing with CMYK only is to see how different black generation in the profile affects the output, for example if I lay down more black by starting black at 0% and also testing various black curves, how grays look in regards to graininess. Of course if the job called for just a percentage of black only you can always use the Black as Inkjet Black or as some RIPs call it, Pure Primaries, setting in your RIP just like you do for getting the rich black of latex by setting Black to 100% and knockout, which turns CM off for what ever percentage you set in the RIP to match the percentage of black only in the job. This will then print only the black ink where the job calls for a percentage of black only.

Another interesting thing about not using lc/lm inks is that you can lay down more of the 4 inks and get a little more punch with more high gamut colors.

 

[ProWraps]

it can be tough.

in all the 3 generations we have had, they keep changing the print head layout as far as what colors are in what head combos, and the qty of heads per certain colors (LC/LM) which one can only deduce is because they just havent figured it out yet. and you are correct, if you are going to spend $20k per printer let alone 20k for 11 printers, you should come to expect that the unit is ready for production.

i dont want to bash them too much, they have made us a great deal of money. but, it has come on the back side of tremendous stress and a lot of loss. neither of which were things i would have ever expected to be the printer part of my business. they are definately the biggest source of problems in my business.

 

[papabud]

While the HP Latex is not the top of the line in printers.
I have been using the HP 360 for a little over a year now. Switched from a mutoh 1304 to this HP.
I am very pleased with the printer overall. Its not all that difficult to load or set up the take up on.
Color wise the gamut isnt as large as some printers but i do get fairly consistent color using 10 pass 600 dpi.
also i took the time to tweak the canned profile for my materials i use just to have them run the way i want them too.
I have been very pleased with my printer overall. I run roughly 300 feet of material a week so not what I would consider high volume.

 

[myront]

This illustration best describes what we're experiencing with the HP360

 

[dypinc]

At 8 pass what is your optimizer set to?

At 8 pass are you using CMYK only and not CMYKcm?

Lowest optimizer setting you can get away with and CMYK only, plus making your own linearization and profile will get you much closer to the red you want. Also consider 10 pass because you can use 120% ink density.

 

[myront]

At 8 pass what is your optimizer set to?

At 8 pass are you using CMYK only and not CMYKcm?

Lowest optimizer setting you can get away with and CMYK only, plus making your own linearization and profile will get you much closer to the red you want. Also consider 10 pass because you can use 120% ink density.

Always CMYKcm on all. Not sure of the optimizer setting. I'm not the print tech. I'll have to ask about that. We've cloned many of the profiles and tweaked the clones here and there but still have not seen acceptable color outputs at anything other than 16 pass. Especially if we're trying to color match previous Mimaki vehicle wrap prints.

To see any real advantage to the HP hype is to print at 8 pass and achieve acceptable colors.

 

[dypinc]

Always CMYKcm on all. Not sure of the optimizer setting. I'm not the print tech. I'll have to ask about that. We've cloned many of the profiles and tweaked the clones here and there but still have not seen acceptable color outputs at anything other than 16 pass. Especially if we're trying to color match previous Mimaki vehicle wrap prints.

To see any real advantage to the HP hype is to print at 8 pass and achieve acceptable colors.

I agree. I still don't see why HP limited these printer like they did. We need to be able to set higher ink densities at 10 pass and lower, and configuring it as a contone device only is very limiting. No chance of controlling light ink curves or maximizing ink limits per substrate.

Unfortunately it is what it is and you just have do what you have to do to get best output.

Having the L360 why are you cloning profiles? Creating new media (NOT CLONING) setups and a new calibration and profile will get you the best chance of achieving the color you want. When using 8 pass or lower using CMYK only if you can and limiting the optimizer as much as you can will get you the maximum gamut possible with these printers.

 

[Vinyldog]

I like the material handling system of my L310. Loads from the front so it can go against the wall. A real plus in my tiny shop. I can print a thirty foot banner and not have to monitor it. No mis-tracking or helping it feed material. Printing on smaller scrap pieces can be an adventure. It doesn't like to.
No smelly fumes, but it will create a fog on humid days.
Finding profiles can be time consuming, but alternate settings seem to work pretty well.
Very stingy on ink. No complaints there.

 

[dypinc]

Finding profiles can be time consuming, but alternate settings seem to work pretty well.

I wonder how you guys with the L3xx version without profiling capabilities or offline profiling capabilities are making it if you have firmware .08 or newer. Seems almost all profiles out there to be found were made with older than .08 firmware which will not give correct color with .08 or newer firmware.

 

[Bugley1]

New HP 360

I just got a HP 360 and i love it i started with a HP 5000/5500...Encad....JV3...JV33 (which i still have as well) Each technology has its pluses and minuses, JV33 is great for small runs the HP 360 is Great for medium to large jobs. Banding and Double Ink Layer and opacity of solvent ink was always a pain, not to mention the smell. With the HP what you lose in loading time you save in a day or 2 in drying time. I do a lot of black stickers, and now with the HP i can print then and cut them as they come off without worry of the shrinkage and curling. Over all My JV33 has been great to me for 8 years, and i will still use it for small stuff. but the new found confidence in a dry band free HP print is awesome!

 

[Vinyldog]

Just FYI, the 310 has the touchscreen too, I'm pretty sure the HP 110 does as well.

The L310 does have the touchscreen but it's smaller. You have to really get the hang of scrolling with it. The text is very small and if you linger too long when scrolling it will open screens you don't intend to. Not a big deal, but irritating when you're in a hurry.

 

[MatzoSigns]

I have to say we've been using our HP latex 370s since August and I love them color is magnificent no banding nice solid color I would say we go through a set of bulk ink every other week and I would never go back to solvent ( have had jv3's jv5's and a jv33) best of luck on what ever you decide to get !!!

How many square feet are you running through to use up that much ink over that time?

Thanks!

 

[Decomurale]

Color consistancy is a major issue with our new latex 360.

UPDATE: After printing with 4 litres of ink I have to say that I had serious color issues starting at about 2 litres used. My last 2 litres have been a nightmare! The thermal heads seem to be less precise after only half their recommended life span. So as it stands right now I am looking at 6 sets of heads per year instead of 3. Very frustrated. I have been reading all kinds of threads about color issues with the latex 360. I also must say that this is something I never experienced with my roland printers nor did I expect to have to deal with a new latex 360. It is still an ongoing issue for us and we have had to repeat many jobs due to panels not matching in color. All our mural jobs are multiple panel jobs. every long run has inconsistencies. I have read about power spikes in the 220 volt line, bad inks, bad firmware, bad heads etc. Bad, Bad, Bad!!! This is unacceptable in my book. We run a high end wall mural company and these issues are killing us. I am actively looking for another solution.

 

[Bly]

Are you printing colour bars in the gutters and flipping alternate panels?