Legal advice, somebody ripped off my design.

[MikePro]

Got my design work ripped off by a local gym. Originally gave him free coroplast signage in exchange for memberships, but when he kept wanting more and more I finally had to charge him. Gave him a bill for the next big order he placed with me... and he, in turn, took my .pdf I originally emailed him and had FedEx Office reprint them for $1 less per panel.
needless to say, I no longer attend his gym.

Sucks you got hosed by a church, tho'. Not only would I be pissed off, but I'd feel guilty about being pissed off, and then even more angry that I'm feeling guilty for no damn good reason.
Stick it to em', before they get the next guy on a monument sign.

 

[Sign_Boy]

That sucks - I'd try to get paid and if they don't pay you go in on of their busy nights say Easter or X-Mas Eve - bring an envelope with the invoice in it. When the collection basket comes around take what they owe you and place your envelope in it.

 

[Jillbeans]

The church agreed to the quote and I started the design process. I met with the church elders and finalized the design a couple of weeks later. I got the green light to start and asked for their deposit. I was told "no problem we will have the deposit for you".

Sounds to me like you have a pretty good chance of getting your design fee paid via our legal system. Hopefully you saved any type of correspondence you had with them, and had them sign the proposal etc. You did the design on a good faith agreement and were promised a deposit by them.

Doesn't matter who the client was, they took something from you without paying for it. They knew it had value. And they can't really argue that it was given to them because they knew you waived your original policy and included in their discounted price. It does make it sting more to know it was a church who did this.

The sign person who donated the wraps may have been told that your design was theirs, although they obviously replicated it without any files which should have been a red flag to them. Anyway, I would contact a lawyer.
Love....Jill

 

[BigfishDM]

Just ask yourself: What would Jesus Do? Just playing around, that is crap that they did that but I dont know if its worth the legal fees to persue that one.

 

[mark galoob]

before you consider legal action or even the threat of legal action, i think you should make an appointment to speak with their cheif pastor. candidly discuss the matter with him/her first and explain the situation. chances are the church has no idea they commited a sin by stealing your work.

i would also consider writing this off.

mark galoob

 

[schramm]

Well after reading only your original post, I think you kinda put yourself into that position. It is common for all of us to trust the Church but lets be real the people that run it are HUMAN! Never in a million years should you of started the design process without a written contract and a 50% deposit!

Now with that said...

Are you entitled to design funds? YES!
Is it worth pursuing this? Maybe, but I would think NOT!
Did you learn a lesson? I bet you did!

As a decorative painter who gilded Churches starting at age 12 with my grandfather, Churches are know for taking advantage of contractors! I did a $40K restoration many years back at a Catholic Church and I got taken for over $7500.

Chock it up to a :Oops: moment and get on with business... You will never win in court not to mention it is bad karma to sue the Church.

 

[JimJenson]

Send em a bill for design work first and see what happens.... don't gouge, just the amount for your time.

I tend to agree with the above suggestion.
Tell them you don't mind they had someone else do the installation, but you assumed they were willing and able to pay for your services, since they did contracted someone to do the job using your design.

They just may get the hint and pay the invoice without needing threat of legal action as encouragement.

Be polite, be diplomatic, but carry a big stick.

 

[GypsyGraphics]

Bill them & if you don't get your artwork payed for, you could use it for taxes.
Donation to a church...

This is probably the best approach if they don't pay the bill. Although, better to consider it a loss than a donation. Once you've billed them, you can't then call it a donation because the bill goes unpaid. Besides, you can write off a loss, but not a donation of services.

...Easter or X-Mas Eve - bring an envelope with the invoice in it. When the collection basket comes around take what they owe you and place your envelope in it.

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

 

[GypsyGraphics]

Why should it matter if it's some church or a squad of Gypsies?

Squad? How many gypsies constitutes a squad. I want a squad!

 

[Techman]

i would also consider writing this off

You cannot write it off. There's nothing to write off. You got nothing in so you cant take something off.

There is no loss either. Except for th etiem you lost. That is not chargeable to a write off.
Cash accounting..

 

[btropical.com]

I would bill then sue real calm and then run them into the mud , craigslists . Make facebook page against church . Buy a crap load of sharpees and hit every bathroom in town claiming preacher a big piece of ( fill in blank ) and loves it in the ( fill in blank ) .. What a great friday weekend pick me up thread Thanks !!

 

[buttons]

I would bill then sue real calm and then run them into the mud , craigslists . Make facebook page against church . Buy a crap load of sharpees and hit every bathroom in town claiming preacher a big piece of ( fill in blank ) and loves it in the ( fill in blank ) .. What a great friday weekend pick me up thread Thanks !!

and that would probably land them back in court

 

[schramm]

Yeah there you go do what btropical said, that will get you somewhere - jail I would guess! I am 100% with you on your side and feel for the loss of income caused by the Church but do you really want your name on court docs suing a Church? How much money are we talking $200-400? It will cost you more then that for 1 hour of court time with an attorney and the first thing the judge will ask is do you have a CONTRACT?:Oops:

 

[Techman]

do you really want your name on court docs suing a Church?

Why not... Are they entitled to some special reverence? They are just a bunch of posers pretending to be all righteous.

 

[schramm]

Why not... Are they entitled to some special reverence? They are just a bunch of posers pretending to be all righteous.

I am not saying that you are not right! I am also not saying that he doesn't have rights to his money - he does! What I am saying is if it is over $200-400 then is it really worth his time? I spent 3 years of my life chasing $7500 from the Catholic Church (they actually have money). I spent almost $4000 in attorneys fees and countless continuances and if this Church is going to scumbag him over a petty amount like $400, he should THANK GOD he didn't do the actual job! What I am saying is he got lucky and he should thank his lucky stars that is all they got and chock it up to experience. I never said he didn't deserve his money as he does!

BY THE WAY 3 YEARS AND I NEVER GOT 1 PENNY! The icing on the cake, the judge was Catholic!

 

[G-Artist]

Are any of you (aside from a few) serious??? Do any of you have a clue (not a put down) of the process or procedure involved? This is NOT a small claims or local court action. This is the exclusive territory of the United States Federal Court system.

There is a basic procedure to the dilemma.

The easiest way is to talk with your lawyer and have that firm guide you through it...at least the first time through. Hopefully s/he has a clue about intellectual property law as that is a very specialized field of law. If not a referral to several IP firms is in order.

The lawyer, (or even if you are a DIY'er) will first start out with a C&D (cease and desist) letter (a prerequisite to any suit or form of action). That will immediately grab their attention and possibly bring them, humbly, to the negotiating table.

Now is the time to decide what constitutes justice.

Have them strip the wrap and never reproduce your art again (via written agreement which I guarantee they will sign and assent to)? That could be justice.

A demand to strip the wrap PLUS pay you a reasonable fee for the art (your IP) is fair. That along with a stipulation they are not to ever use that art ever again.

Sue them as well as their wrap provider and all individuals involved in the piracy (you really should name everyone who participated in the chain of events otherwise your award may not get paid...one of them or all collectively should have the bucks to pay you your award PLUS your lawyer's fees plus all costs)?

Only you can decide.

In the mean time, do not make any threats. Always act composed and in a business-like manner. After all this is business and nothing more. All communications and interactions should be in writing - never oral if you elect to DIY. If you engage the services of a lawyer then sit back and let whatever unfolds happen and get on with your life. Any direct inquiries you have from the church org. you merely politely refer them to your counsel.

Let me inject a personal note here. As many other members have stated or alluded to, in this thread and countless other threads, Christian churches, as customers, are sleazy...plain and simple. Personally, any business that wears their religion on their sleeve (or business card/letterhead/truckside) I avoid like the plague. In the end, they always try to screw you in some way no matter how slight. Be it a church or an individual man (woman?) of the cloth they all should be treated, business-wise, like any other enterprise or human. Hold them accountable. If you don't who will?

Soap box mode off.

 

[Techman]

Are any of you (aside from a few) serious??? Do any of you have a clue (not a put down) of the process or procedure involved? This is NOT a small claims or local court action. This is the exclusive territory of the United States Federal Court system.

Why???????

 

[schramm]

quote from g-artist:
Let me inject a personal note here. As many other members have stated or alluded to, in this thread and countless other threads, Christian churches, as customers, are sleazy...plain and simple. Personally, any business that wears their religion on their sleeve (or business card/letterhead/truckside) I avoid like the plague. In the end, they always try to screw you in some way no matter how slight. Be it a church or an individual man (woman?) of the cloth they all should be treated, business-wise, like any other enterprise or human. Hold them accountable. If you don't who will?

While I may agree with most of this statement, it is dumb business to assume your going to get screwed going into any job. Christians make up over 90% of the human race do you really want to dump that thought process into business??? Granted they are not all in your face Christians or the knuckleheads with the fish swimming on the back or side of their truck but they are there. This incident that we are talking about is a single incident not an attack on humanity.

Where I totally agree with you is, that little fish symbol seems to mean "BORN AGAIN" which is the symbol of get the hell out of my shop!

 

[Allied Digital]

. . . bring an envelope with the invoice in it. When the collection basket comes around take what they owe you and place your envelope in it.

LOL funny

 

[bob]

Are any of you (aside from a few) serious??? Do any of you have a clue (not a put down) of the process or procedure involved? This is NOT a small claims or local court action. This is the exclusive territory of the United States Federal Court system.

...merciful deletia...

Since myself and others have indeed prevailed in small claims court in identical circumstances in many different jurisdictions, I can only conclude that in these matters you don't know your ass from a warm biscuit.