long time adobe user WOWed by corel x4

[signmeup]

Drawing line: pen tool

The help menu in CS3 looks like an entire manual, it does not go to the website. Maybe that is in an older version

The "help" button in Illy CS4 most certainly does open a website. You have to disconnect your internet connection to see the built in help files. Nowhere do you get this information on the box your new copy of Illy came in. You're just expected to instinctively know this.....I guess. It makes it very annoying to click "help" when you're trying to figure out something that is already frustrating you.

I'm sure someone could teach me to use the software but I do not feel that I can figure it out on my own.

I gave up on it since I couldn't find anything in it that I can't do in Corel anyway.

Like I said...if you've mastered Illy, I bow to your superior abilities.

 

[Artildawn]

It's unfortunate they no longer provide a Mac version... I think they stopped around V7 or so...

12 was the last version available for mac. The Adobe products are so entrenched on the macs that corel simply couldn't gain enough ground to make it worth their while.

 

[Joe Diaz]

My point exactly.

Customers aren't informed enough to provide the correct, color-profiled artwork to me. Hence... I prefer Illy for that.

I can print fine from an eps I create from Corel.. I know what to do to make it work... but the average end user doesn't.

And Rep - that's what I was saying.. no cumbersome export to get that eps from Illy...

love seeing the differing opinions..

The problem you are talking about has nothing to do with software. You run into those same issues with illustrator. Those customers you are speaking of need to understand that the color they see on their screen will never be guaranteed to look identical to what you print. It doesn't matter if you have Corel and they have illy or you both have illy, you are still going to have that problem.

Its similar to when the client sends you a file where the lettering isn't converted to a vector objects, or when they don't covert their paths to shapes. These are issues that transcend software preferences.

Really if you wanted, you could make the colors you see in corel look identical to what you are seeing in adobe with Corel Color Managment system. So when you design files that you are going to eventually send to adobe users what you see on your screen will be close to what they see (keeping in mind that monitors are all different). And if an adobe user sends you an AI or EPS The colors you would see would be close to what they see (again keeping in mind that monitors are all different).

In other words, it would be no different than if a customer using illustrator sent you and ai file that you opened in illustrator. In that case any changes in color from what they see on their screen compared to the colors that end up printed is due to the monitor and the printer, not software.

Besides, if that is your main issue, why not simply have the customer send you an eps that you directly print out of versa works, thus making color their problem not yours.

In my opinion, Corel's ability to manage colors is one of my favorite features, I hardily see it as a flaw.

 

[Rick]

I would switch to Corel if they had better layer tools similar to Illustrator, multiple scales on a single page, better stroke options-- especially the dashes, fix the quirks in their swatches so I can dump my templates and pre-made drawings in with little hassle and more drawing/editing options to their scale tools.

What I find with Corel's tools is good enough for me to own a copy, but not even close enough to switch. Corel will not make me a better designer, but if I could shave time off without it impacting my work/output then I am all for it. Since I do more than 4 color work and signs, my modified version of Illustrator works really good with my workflow, but Adobe can learn a thing or 2 from Corel (and Freehand)

 

[Bigdawg]

Thanks for the long reply Joe.

I am not talking about matching screen colors... I am VERY clear to my customers that unless their system is fully calibrated to MY system that will never happen.

I am talking about color builds that should print a certain color and don't. I have been in color since before there were computer (used to cut ruby and zipatone to create the colors needed) so I've got color theory for printing down pretty good...

What I am talking about is the printed CMYK color vs the CMYK values and how they should print. And I would NEVER knowingly instruct a customer to set themselves up for failure like you suggest... it is my job... my responsibility to make sure they get the best they can from me... and I would never just say to them - sorry - it's your problem... this is the real world and things like that get around quick...

 

[The Vector Doctor]

The "help" button in Illy CS4 most certainly does open a website. You have to disconnect your internet connection to see the built in help files. Nowhere do you get this information on the box your new copy of Illy came in. You're just expected to instinctively know this.....I guess. It makes it very annoying to click "help" when you're trying to figure out something that is already frustrating you.

I'm sure someone could teach me to use the software but I do not feel that I can figure it out on my own.

I gave up on it since I couldn't find anything in it that I can't do in Corel anyway.

Like I said...if you've mastered Illy, I bow to your superior abilities.

Maybe it is a Mac thing or you did not install it to begin with? When I click F1 or choose Help I get this screen (attached)

 

[Rodi]

I'm embarrased to admit that I can't make head or tails of Illustrator. I have the latest version and I can't do anything at all with it. It frustrates me no end that I can't get my head around it.... it just makes no sence to me. Corel came to me very easily.

some of us feel the same way about corel, we know you can do it, but it feels so out of sorts.

 

[signmeup]

Maybe it is a Mac thing or you did not install it to begin with? When I click F1 or choose Help I get this screen (attached)

Eric that's CS3....I have CS4. Apparantly Adobe made an "improvement" to the help files.

 

[signmeup]

BigDog....if you have both Corel and Illy on your computer why don't you just open the customers Corel file, in Corel and click "save as .ai" and then print it? Doesn't it fix the problem?

 

[HaroldDesign]

I used to use Corelya, but then I grew out of it and started using tools like Illy.

...Just kidding. I would like to take a look at Corel again after all these years in Illy.

 

[Joe Diaz]

And I would NEVER knowingly instruct a customer to set themselves up for failure like you suggest... it is my job... my responsibility to make sure they get the best they can from me... and I would never just say to them - sorry - it's your problem... this is the real world and things like that get around quick...

I didn't suggest that. You are missing the point. The point I am trying to make is that software doesn't mater, If you as the middleman take your corel draw or illy out of the equation, and directly print their exported file, you will still have color issues.

The software you chose to use doesn't change the fact that there are those customers out there that don't understand color or how color management and printers work, yet insists that you somehow crawl inside their head and pick out the colors they see.

What I would suggest is this: If customer insist on a specific color, we have them pick from our pantone color swatches. Problem solved.

 

[luggnut]

I would switch to Corel if they had better layer tools similar to Illustrator, multiple scales on a single page, better stroke options

since i only have a day or 2 toying around in corel (mostly with shaping and transparent gradients) i haven't really toyed with the layers and things. i do use layers a lot in illustrator so i'll be checking that out in corel. i like to take a layer illy file and export it as PSD then it opens with layers in PS... nice.

 

[Rick]

I have played with it.

The biggest way I use layers to design in multiple scale. Since you can assign selection edge colors to a layer, you always know what scale you are working in. If you have incorporated layers into your design workflow, play with the layers in Corel before thinking about a clean switch. The few little tricks it does makes for some easy effects, does not make it enough for me to make that switch and since I can toggle between PC and Mac, I can use my Corel if I need it then import it into Illustrator.

 

[Rick]

by the way, have you figured out the transparent gradients in Illustrator? It has it..

 

[Replicator]

Rick,

You can create as many layers as you want in Corel . . . !

 

[Rick]

Rick,

You can create as many layers as you want in Corel . . . !

I know, thats not what I am talking about...

In Illustrator you can assign colors (and title that layer) to your layer, that way when you select a layer in 1/8" scale, it will light the edges up in blue or in 1" scale, in magenta. You know on the fly what layer you are on by the assignable edge colors and with CadTools, you can assign a scale to that particular layer.

 

[Bigdawg]

I didn't suggest that. You are missing the point. The point I am trying to make is that software doesn't mater, If you as the middleman take your corel draw or illy out of the equation, and directly print their exported file, you will still have color issues.

The software you chose to use doesn't change the fact that there are those customers out there that don't understand color or how color management and printers work, yet insists that you somehow crawl inside their head and pick out the colors they see.

What I would suggest is this: If customer insist on a specific color, we have them pick from our pantone color swatches. Problem solved.

No Joe... you aren't getting it either...

My point... my only point... is that Illy... straight out the box... handles color way better than Corel.. there is no "learning" curve on how to get it to print correct color... so you keep proving my point when you say that Corel has to be adjusted and set up to print correctly... in Illy there is a bare minimum of that (basically your resolution settings)... so IMO Illy handles REAL WORLD color issue much better than Corel. No customer training.. no exporting an eps... no assigned profile that will override my versaworks profile... which is exactly what I want.

signmeup - when I print for a customer that has provided a cdr file I do just that.. but that adds setup time that we don't charge for on wholesale jobs.

 

[Joe Diaz]

I know, thats not what I am talking about...

In Illustrator you can assign colors (and title that layer) to your layer, that way when you select a layer in 1/8" scale, it will light the edges up in blue or in 1" scale, in magenta. You know on the fly what layer you are on by the assignable edge colors and with CadTools, you can assign a scale to that particular layer.

Ah yes... designing in scale, something I don't miss from my illustrator days.:Big Laugh

 

[Tony Teveris]

Nothing should be considered "print ready" unless you are the printer or the user that gave you the file has "your" printing device's color profiles and uses them.

Joe has definitly has the right idea. Pay attention.

 

[Rick]

The work I do I have to design in scale in whatever program I use, otherwise the city will not have any drawings to approve and architects would laugh me out of the office.