New HP Designjet L25500 Series Printers

[MachServTech]

Had an opportunity to get my hands on this machine last week. It seems like it will be a good production machine in office environments. I am a little concerned about the reliability of the media holder/takup, as the rolls of banner and adhesive are much heavier than the z6100 style components are designed for.

The machine is based on the incredibly successful Z6100, which you find in every copy shop, quick print shop, architect office, FedEx Kinkos or Staples……..so who do you think is the target market?

so what post were you responding to?
I would like to have a discussion about this.

 

[Printhead]

heads need replacement every ~40 liters

Quoting myself on that one. Just got out of a meeting with the hp rep, HP is gonna change your heads every 40 liters, but the guarantee only covers 20 liters. So if your heads are screwed after, say, 21 liters, you'll have to take the bill. The rep couldn't give us any reasonable explanation for that, so it's kind of only justifiable by, watch out for this one; HP screwing you.

We're seriously considering going with Gandi/Agfa for our next machine. The L25500 looks awesome and prints like no other, but the ink is just too expensive and there is still this problem of liquid clear that neither HP, 3M, Avery or the clear laminate suppliers want to solve.

 

[KevSign]

Got couple quotes for this printer:

60" HP Printer L25500, 6 Inks ($165 per 770ml), Rip (if you already onyx use -$2900), Install and Delivery total around $29,000, without rip $26,000, Rebate $3000. So your pocket around $23,000.

1- Good to Switch?
2- Quality (Better than Mutoh)?
3- Ink Cost
4- Electric require 220
5- New Latex (Don't know)?
6- Printer Reliable ?

May be stay with solvent for while! Right now customer doesn’t care for what your equipment at long as Quality and low price.

 

[Robert M]

HP needs 220V?

Do the HP spec sheets show how much power this system needs? Most other printers in the 60" range use 110. It would be interesting to see what the yearly costs of running a "green machine" would be in comparison to the current solvent printers.

 

[solock]

and FWIW, 220V is more efficient (and cheaper) in the long run (in the US) due to how power is measured. the US made 110 power the standard because they could charge twice as much for it at least, thats the impression i've been under.

The electricity you buy is in watts. Less current (amps) maybe but the costs are the same for 110 and 220. Infrastructure limits come into play to make 200 more logical, as in 1500 watts is about the limit to a normal household outlet, as the wiring is 14ga or maybe 1800-2000 watts on a more modern 20amp circuit wired with 12ga wire. That same 12ga wire (same copper cost) would run a 4000 watt appliance.

The infrastructure (wiring in the facility) costs to run a 4000watt appliance on 110 would need something like 6ga wire and be too expensive to use.

But the cost to actually run the appliance would be the same cause watts is watts.

Not saying the latex printer makes sense, cause they are running it on TWO 220 lines... That usually means that thats a lot of watts...

 

[signage]

Solock receptacles are to be wire with 12ga and lighting 14ga so the maximum current to 110vac is 2750! Now saying that there are some wired with 14ga if they are in series with lighting in a room!

 

[artray]

Changed my mind

P.S. Contacted hp again this morning complaining that after waiting 3 weeks, I have still not received the promised email containing the HP L25500 price and local Atlanta dealer info. Told them they were close to losing a faithful HP printer customer. They gave me another phone number to call.[/QUOTE]

Did not want to wait until 2010 to purchase the L25500 so I took delivery of a Z3200 this week.

 

[KevSign]

Just Ordered my today, will ready 2-3 weeks and Sold my Mutoh 1604 for 10K. As I see my dealer they can print fabric on big version L65500, this fabric could not print on Solvent Printers. I had Z6100 now combine this L25500 hope both print same quality for indoor and outdoor.

 

[visualeyez]

So it uses more power than a solvent printer. The ink is more expensive. The video shows a bunch of parts you have to replace all the freaking time. It doesn't contour cut, it just prints. The prints don't even last any longer than solvent prints.

What was the real benefit again?

 

[astro8]

So it uses more power than a solvent printer. The ink is more expensive. The video shows a bunch of parts you have to replace all the freaking time. It doesn't contour cut, it just prints. The prints don't even last any longer than solvent prints.

What was the real benefit again?

It's GREEN man! It doesn't release any solvents into the atmosphere only creates pollution from the coal burning power stations that are running at overload to keep these printers heaters running and airconditioners going to keep your printroom cool as the printer heaters are heating it up.

 

[bedgood]

We purchased a L65500 in October from the NOLA SGIA show, where we also saw the L25500. After working the L65500 for 3 months or so, I wish we would have bought 2 L25500 60". The L65500 replaced our two Seiko 64S solvent horses, which we had about 4 to 5 years. Those were great printers and one person could manage them both. The L65500, not so much, it takes two people to load the larger rolls.

One person can load some of the rolls. The L65500 is for longer runs, where a shop may be running one image hundred's of times, the L25500 is more for the shorter run shops, like us. We would change media on the 64S probably 8+ times a day, where if we change media 8+ tines on the L65500, it will take 10 hours to run what we have.

We have had to re-adjust our products that we offer Green because of the L65500 management. The L65500 media has to be taped to a take-up spindle, which waste almost 6' of media before the print starts! The L25500 can be changed faster and by one person, and the media doesn't have to be connected to a spindle, much like the 64S and the HP5's.

Now we have been looking at the L25500 for the past week or so to compliment our L65500 and just found out something interesting. Although both models do use the same latex ink, there is a color shift. The explanation that our supplier gave is that the difference comes in the manner in which the ink cures in both printers. With the L65500 printer the length to traverse the platen is longer and the print head is open to the air. With the L25500 printer the print head travels a shorter distance and the print head is enclosed in the printer shell and air is forced across the media to assist in the drying of the ink. This difference in ink drying mechanics has a net effect that the L25500 print has a slightly more matte finish and the L65500 has a more glossy finish.

Media wise, the L65500 has printed on every media I can through at it, except for gloss banner. The plasticizer that the manufacturer applies to the media to keep it from sticking to itself, that is what makes the noise as it unrolls, interacts with certain latex colors and causes this effect that looks like a laminate was applied and then removed, it's dull and spotty.

I am going to be starting new threads on all of the latex issues that we have seen and hopefully will help in some buying decisions and maybe HP will fix some of these.

 

[MachServTech]

So it uses more power than a solvent printer. The ink is more expensive. The video shows a bunch of parts you have to replace all the freaking time. It doesn't contour cut, it just prints. The prints don't even last any longer than solvent prints.

What was the real benefit again?

Do your homework

The ink is a LOT less expensive ...20 cents per ml
Replacement parts...you mean printheads....I think that's a good thing that hey are cheap and plug and play....no more head strike worries and always perfect print quality.
Prints last 3+ years outdoor without lamination

Why knock a new technology? Lets see where this goes....more options in this industry help us. I hope HP is sucessfull with this because maybe other manufacturers will come out with their version of latex and more competition gives us better capabilities.

So far it has fewer - than +
I think that it isnt great that it has two 220 connections, but I don't think it will use much more power than the solvent printer/dryer/ventilation scrubber it is replacing. So far the demo machines I have worked with have been easy to use and have given excellent print quality (albeit a little granier than the competitors) with no banding (for a change).
These machines will sit for weeks with no printing and no maintenance (ever...think aqueous printers) then run a 40 foot banner with no head strikes, no nozzle dropout and no advance banding.

They are not the second coming, but they are not half bad either.

Lets just be realistic about the benifits and problems.

 

[BigfishDM]

http://hpl25500users.ning.com/

Here is a new user group for those units if anyone is interested.

 

[MachServTech]

Ok anybody have one of these installed yet. What are your impressions? What medias do you like/dislike on it?

 

[SE SignSupply]

Ok anybody have one of these installed yet. What are your impressions? What medias do you like/dislike on it?

Haven't you run one before?

 

[MachServTech]

Yes, I have fooled around with a machine, but that's way different than running one in production.

My question pertains to what runs well (or doesn't) on these new machines and what are the first impressions....in production......as that helps weigh whether or not I should buy one.

 

[bigben]

Yes, I have fooled around with a machine, but that's way different than running one in production.

My question pertains to what runs well (or doesn't) on these new machines and what are the first impressions....in production......as that helps weigh whether or not I should buy one.

Same thing here. I will make my mind between the hp l25500 60in and the Roland vs-640. I know those are completely different, but each one have something I want.

hp: green machine, no drying time, print quality, print heads.
Roland: reliability of the brand, print white and silver, faster.

I think for the price would be cheaper with the roland due to the printer/cutter combo. For the hp, I will need to buy a a cutter and rip. So at the end, hp will be more expensive. But have 2 machines to print and cut would be a good thing.

Plus, I did not hear any reviews from the owners about the hp. My Roland rep told me HP have alot of problem with them. Maybe it's just a sales men BS but I would like to hear it form the owners. I know Meritt bought 4 of them, but I can't have any review on it.

So help me here to make a good choice!!!!

Ben

 

[MachServTech]

I know Meritt bought 4 of them, but I can't have any review on it.

The folks at Merritt are good about communicating to us on the forum, I'm sure we will get some feedback sooner or later.

I wold also like to know what experiences folks have had with Caldera and l25500 and Flexi as well.

 

[phxsign]

I love our machine. We have had it for around 3 weeks and no real issues. Cheap banner material does not work. We now use ultra flex. The fast dry is nice. Easy loading. Good colors. We have run about 3k sq ft with little troubles.

 

[KevSign]

We got our 3 wk ago, Great machine addition with our HPz6100 and Roland Pro2 745. So far we print on Orajet3165RA, 6mil Adhesive back for trade show print 1 roll 100ft no problem customer mount on foam board. 1 Astro van wrap (installer like it better than solvent, solvent make media thinner, Latex ink print on 3M material after lam handling easy and wrap faster as my install said). Specially is Light box material, we never print that great with Roland or HPz6100, with latex-ink print and dry right way and Ink Density very nice.

I am waiting for 2nd generation will buy 1 more to replace my Roland Pro2 745.

We had to replace motherboard because fail start-up, so far HP take care every thing right away with next day services, parts available to replace. Most dealer just install machine and training.

I will post some picture when I get time.