Roland Eco-Sol MAX Ink

[phototec]

That is my point EXACTLY, the prices very all over the place - so how can Denver Sign Supply sell them for $113.95 and make a profit, yet the others say "I can't sell for less that $116"?

Someone should get on here and offer Signs101 members a package deal, purchase at least a set of 4 or 6 (depending on printer) for a good flat rate price and FREE shipping. That would start the NEW year off right! Think you would get a lot of orders...

Just saying...

I would like to offer anyone who is interested a limited time, forum only ink special. I will offer anyone who is willing to purchase at least (4) 440 carts of Roland OEM Eco Sol Max ink in one order - the price of $109 each with Free Ground Shipping from our California warehouse. That is $109 per cart if you buy 4 at a time and free ground shipping. I will offer this at least until 2/23/15 and hopefully beyond to encourage everyone to trust Imprintables and let us earn your business.

Contact me if you have any questions or would like to take advantage of this offer. Thanks for listening!

BINGO, a supplier has stepped up to the challenge!

 

[zigns62]

Inks

We been using 20/20 inks or the last two years now with no problems. We get them from grimco at a good price. They always have them in stock.

 

[Sign Works]

I just wanted to say that as a consumer, I am a shopper. I would rarely pay someone a higher price to get a perfectly equivalent item. However, I have learned that even if you are buying the exact same product from someone you don't always get the same thing. You are buying more than just the product, there is service, support, education etc. Some people see value in those intangibles, some don't. It depends on the situation and the product I guess. I recently bought some new appliances and saved a ton over what anyone locally could sell them for and now I am regretting the decision because I am having issues with them....

With that said, any dealer out there would agree that the profit on OEM ink is minimal at best. It's hard to justify practically giving it away unless you are getting a lot of repeat business with other products like vinyl and banner materials.

I would like to offer anyone who is interested a limited time, forum only ink special. I will offer anyone who is willing to purchase at least (4) 440 carts of Roland OEM Eco Sol Max ink in one order - the price of $109 each with Free Ground Shipping from our California warehouse. That is $109 per cart if you buy 4 at a time and free ground shipping. I will offer this at least until 2/23/15 and hopefully beyond to encourage everyone to trust Imprintables and let us earn your business.

Contact me if you have any questions or would like to take advantage of this offer. Thanks for listening!

What about the 220 carts?

 

[LeeTringes]

What about the 220 carts?

I can offer the 220s for $60 a piece for orders of 6 or more with free ground shipping from California.

 

[TimToad]

Now that shopping around has been deemed a semi-patriotic thing to do and a civil right by someone here, I thought I'd point out another very common American practice in business which is called a loss leader. Wal-Garbage does it, and I'm willing to bet most of the sign suppliers offering a really great price on a few regularly used items like ink carts do it. What you need to be watching is what is their usual price on some of the other items you buy regularly. I'd bet my last dollar that they make up for the "loss" on the ink carts in other areas.

I know for a fact that I can get my Roland ink carts a little cheaper elsewhere and I also know that there are lots of other items I'd be tempted to buy from my current supplier for convenience sake, but they are priced too high. So, I pick my battles and do the best we can to economize.

What I don't do is waste tons of time tripping over manhole covers to save a nickel. We shop around for certain items a couple times a year and that's about it.

 

[rmcginn]

After looking around at all of the various resellers in this thread it seems a better question might be why Roland ink is priced high in general...? Roland ink comes from Epson and they (Epson) sell solvent ink at a different price point:

SureColor S70670 - Epson UltraChrome GSX

Description	Product No.	Capacity	Price (MSRP)
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Black	T715100	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Cyan	T715200	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Magenta	T715300	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Yellow	T715400	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Light Cyan	T715500	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Light Magenta	T715600	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Light Black	T715700	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Orange	T715800	700ml	$174.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - White	T715A00	600ml	$229.95
EPSON SureColor S70670 - Silver Metallic	T715B00	350ml	$249.95

 

[player]

Are you sure the Roland inks are a lot higher?

$174.95 / 700 = .2499 per ml

$109.00 / 440 = .2477 per ml

 

[Robert M]

MSRP vs MSRP

Keeping it fair, the Roland 440 has an MSRP of 128.99 making it .29 mL, making them more expensive per mL

 

[TimToad]

Keeping it fair, the Roland 440 has an MSRP of 128.99 making it .29 mL, making them more expensive per mL

Considering we've established that barely anybody sells or pays for carts at the MSRP, what do most people pay for the newly introduced comparison product?

 

[TimToad]

I thought you didn't care, and didn't have time to be bothered checking prices on materials?

That's not what I said at all.

This is what I said. "What I don't do is waste tons of time tripping over manhole covers to save a nickel. We shop around for certain items a couple times a year and that's about it."

I like saving money as much as anybody, I just don't make finding deals a full time vocation.

Plus, I was trying to be funny about the fact that a whole new tangent was created and to be fair to Roland, we need to know what the Epson people are actually paying, not the MSRP of the cartridges used in the example.

 

[TimToad]

You silly Canadians. I thought you wanted a good argument...... LOL

To expand the topic one notch further. Is there anybody out there getting more than .50 or .75 per cart for recycling?

 

[niksagkram]

You silly Canadians. I thought you wanted a good argument...... LOL

To expand the topic one notch further. Is there anybody out there getting more than .50 or .75 per cart for recycling?

YOU GET MONEY BACK FOR RECYCLING CARTS???????

 

[Sign Works]

I can offer the 220s for $60 a piece for orders of 6 or more with free ground shipping from California.

I asked about the 220's due to a lower ink demand than most. If I have to double up on 2 colors I'd might as well buy the 440's. At 6 cart minimum I'll have to pass, you would have had me at a 4 cart minimum.

 

[premiercolour]

Every eco solvent clogs if you don't take care of the machine. It is just nature of the ink.

We went to a volume shop who has Roland Soljet XJ740 yesterday(1/28/15). Dusted, runs non stop. Nazda sold the the printer and converted the printer to use Nazdar ink from day 1 so the warranty remains. Not sure how they do that. Anyway, had Nazdar ink for four years, not a single problem. Changed 1m head 2 years later, changed 1y and recently 1lc head. It works great owner said, maintain by one of the best Roland techs here in S. California. It has Nazdar Bulk Feed System. We had to pull the system from the top of the printer, it wouldn't stop leaking ink even the valves were turned close, had to tilted to an angle so it stopped. But the look on the owner's face is priceless. Anyway, the problem with the printer is one of the two o rings in the cartridge insert assembly actually disappeared. No one touched that part ever according to the owner unless he lied. I think the o ring was actually dissolved in it because I see black particles when it is soaked in the cleaning solution. We replaced the o ring. Problem fixed. Now, the funnel to the waste tank is completely clogged. Waste ink got out of the system after a strong clean, created a mess. Took the waste tank assembly apart, the size of the tubing just too small that ink had clogged the funnel. Get that a good cleaning. Customer is happy. Not the biggest bill but was well over $500.

What does Roland do when something happened to your out of warranty printer? You pay for it. This is what Premier Colour do. We come out four times a year to do preventive maintenances on your printer for a small charge. You use our supplies; let us take care of your printer. Service is within s. California only.

440ml Cartridge $74.00.
1L Bottle ink $84.00. ( Usage > 20 cartridge / month)
www.premiercolour.com

How many carts do you run through a printer in a month? I think this is key to running 3rd party ink. Seems the only people that have any success are the ones that go through dozens of carts a month. We don't.

Have you had any issues with waste lines clogging? That's what happened to me. Then it started backing up through the system and clogging heads.

Same guy that sold me the printer sold me the 3rd party ink. After the printer completely stopped he said: "Didn't you know you're supposed to clean or replace those lines every six months". Gee, thanks for telling me after the fact. (d!ck move)

That is the least of what happened. Best part is after the printer crashed the second time he wouldn't return my calls or send a tech. I was calm, cordial and used no foul language. I needed to get jobs out and was simply asking for help.


In my mind there are a bunch of issues that need to be addressed:

Does anyone using 3rd party ink track consumption? I did. It went through 3rd party carts like there was no tomorrow. Savings? Negligible.

What about overspray? My printer was caked with it. So bad that it coated the encoder strip. Carts were dirt cheap but loaded with VOC's.(see above)

Clogged dampers? Went through them like they only cost a dollar.

One thing I can't complain about was the color was just like OEM.



As far as "warranty" I posted a short time ago regarding this. In a nutshell they're your best buddy when they're getting your money. Have a problem they don't know you.

They pay attorney's to make sure they have little to no liability exposure. What chance does a sign shop guy have against that?

 

[premiercolour]

We are ready to buy couple sets if someone gives us price @ $109 w/ free shipping. People love this stuff.

 

[LeeTringes]

We are ready to buy couple sets if someone gives us price @ $109 w/ free shipping. People love this stuff.

Contact me if you are interested in $109 plus free shipping for an order of at least 4! I would be happy to set you up!

 

[rjssigns]

Every eco solvent clogs if you don't take care of the machine. It is just nature of the ink.

I'm going to take exception to this remark.

Since I switched back to OEM ink I have not had one issue. No clogged lines, no clogged dampers, no ruined pump, no clogged heads creating a complete work stoppage, no overspray coated encoder causing worthless prints etc..

Like I had said in another post some time back. If I had the money I would do a full lab analysis and chemical breakdown of OEM versus 3rd party ink.

My bet is the manufacturers know that will never happen so can deviate from the OEM formula and no one will ever know.

What is the exact solvent blend? What is the purity of the solvents? What is the filtration process? How fine are the pigments ground? What is the purity of the pigments? What percentage of foreign particles are in a sample? Specific gravity? What are the QC steps to ensure consistency?

Do all the chemicals and even cartridge components come from ISO certified sources?

The ISO certification is an odd thing. It does not in fact guarantee a given level of quality. It does however maintain that whatever you're producing is consistent to the standards set forth during your certification.

I will stop here as there are other things I've noticed, but have no desire to start another p!ss!ng match.

 

[gnatt66]

6+ years and i've never changed a single part on my vp300. nothing. i had one waste line clog, one black ink issue with banding ( but the test print was perfect ). both i associate with 3rd party ink. i wasnt using the printer very much at all and i know that matters a LOT. but that brief stint of non Roland ink ( a set of 220s i believe) caused the only issues ive ever had ever. so...in my opinion..if you are a "little guy" it's not worth the headache.

$105/440 cart on ebay works for me.

 

[premiercolour]

No little guy is bad guy. We love little guy because they pay premium(ops), they don't complaint as much. They don't want to drive us down the prices when they order 50 rolls.

6+ years and i've never changed a single part on my vp300. nothing. i had one waste line clog, one black ink issue with banding ( but the test print was perfect ). both i associate with 3rd party ink. i wasnt using the printer very much at all and i know that matters a LOT. but that brief stint of non Roland ink ( a set of 220s i believe) caused the only issues ive ever had ever. so...in my opinion..if you are a "little guy" it's not worth the headache.

$105/440 cart on ebay works for me.

 

[J Hill Designs]

To expand the topic one notch further. Is there anybody out there getting more than .50 or .75 per cart for recycling?

$2 credit at staples per cart, up to 20 per month

 

[premiercolour]

oh no you again. just joking. Thanks for the comments. Made my day.

We buy Roland machines, fix'em up, resell them with our inks. Put guarantee on it for a while now. Love Bordeaux ink because there is no problems. The only reason people call us is that they want to order ink. The more ink they order, the more savings there is. It is win win situation.

So we get used Roland ink cartridges. One day i see ink drips from one of the eco sol max yellow ink cartridge. It got out of the aluminum bag maybe from where the o ring is, wherever it dripped, dissolved, onto 5th cartridge down. Plastic of the cartridge is damaged or dissolved. If it was from an aftermarket ink? BIG DEAL. If it was from OEM, well, people make mistake.

This is what many people do. They chose the least expensive aftermarket ink to use, cost to almost nothing dampers $2.00 with free shipping from China), cap tops, consumables and claim it is the ink! Let's put least expensive dampers, cap tops, consumable, blades to a new Roland with OEM ink. Let's see how it performs.

My question again that you've been avoiding from last forum. Who is this aftermarket ink brand you were using?

Every eco solvent clogs if you don't take care of the machine. It is just nature of the ink.

I'm going to take exception to this remark.

Since I switched back to OEM ink I have not had one issue. No clogged lines, no clogged dampers, no ruined pump, no clogged heads creating a complete work stoppage, no overspray coated encoder causing worthless prints etc..

Like I had said in another post some time back. If I had the money I would do a full lab analysis and chemical breakdown of OEM versus 3rd party ink.

My bet is the manufacturers know that will never happen so can deviate from the OEM formula and no one will ever know.

What is the exact solvent blend? What is the purity of the solvents? What is the filtration process? How fine are the pigments ground? What is the purity of the pigments? What percentage of foreign particles are in a sample? Specific gravity? What are the QC steps to ensure consistency?

Do all the chemicals and even cartridge components come from ISO certified sources?

The ISO certification is an odd thing. It does not in fact guarantee a given level of quality. It does however maintain that whatever you're producing is consistent to the standards set forth during your certification.

I will stop here as there are other things I've noticed, but have no desire to start another p!ss!ng match.

 

[rjssigns]

oh no you again. just joking. Thanks for the comments. Made my day.

We buy Roland machines, fix'em up, resell them with our inks. Put guarantee on it for a while now. Love Bordeaux ink because there is no problems. The only reason people call us is that they want to order ink. The more ink they order, the more savings there is. It is win win situation.

So we get used Roland ink cartridges. One day i see ink drips from one of the eco sol max yellow ink cartridge. It got out of the aluminum bag maybe from where the o ring is, wherever it dripped, dissolved, onto 5th cartridge down. Plastic of the cartridge is damaged or dissolved. If it was from an aftermarket ink? BIG DEAL. If it was from OEM, well, people make mistake.

This is what many people do. They chose the least expensive aftermarket ink to use, cost to almost nothing dampers $2.00 with free shipping from China), cap tops, consumables and claim it is the ink! Let's put least expensive dampers, cap tops, consumable, blades to a new Roland with OEM ink. Let's see how it performs.

My question again that you've been avoiding from last forum. Who is this aftermarket ink brand you were using?

Check your PM's I will give you all the details.

 

[premiercolour]

Lots of details. Thank you. Thankfully that company is closed down for good.

We have two exact same Roland VP300i(s). Any of you folks can send us a print file. We will print and compare next to each other with Eco Sol Max and Bordeaux inks. We can barely see any difference. We are not an ink manufacturer. We are resellers. We are not bonded to any products but from testings, experience and stratagies to vote whose ink we want to carry. Bordeaux product has been promising. Savings is 70% over OEM.

www.premiercolour.com

Francis

oh no you again. just joking. Thanks for the comments. Made my day.

We buy Roland machines, fix'em up, resell them with our inks. Put guarantee on it for a while now. Love Bordeaux ink because there is no problems. The only reason people call us is that they want to order ink. The more ink they order, the more savings there is. It is win win situation.

So we get used Roland ink cartridges. One day i see ink drips from one of the eco sol max yellow ink cartridge. It got out of the aluminum bag maybe from where the o ring is, wherever it dripped, dissolved, onto 5th cartridge down. Plastic of the cartridge is damaged or dissolved. If it was from an aftermarket ink? BIG DEAL. If it was from OEM, well, people make mistake.

This is what many people do. They chose the least expensive aftermarket ink to use, cost to almost nothing dampers $2.00 with free shipping from China), cap tops, consumables and claim it is the ink! Let's put least expensive dampers, cap tops, consumable, blades to a new Roland with OEM ink. Let's see how it performs.

My question again that you've been avoiding from last forum. Who is this aftermarket ink brand you were using?

Check your PM's I will give you all the details.