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Signs 101 Membership Qualifications

Should major companies with in-house sign departments be accepted as new members?

  • Yes

    Votes: 103 46.4%
  • No

    Votes: 55 24.8%
  • Don't Care One Way or the Other

    Votes: 64 28.8%

  • Total voters
    222

mikefine

New Member
Gino: I respectfully submit that I couldn’t disagree more with your opposition comments on this issue, and with the 11 who disapprove so far.

And I think this decision is very important.

I say let them in.

I feel that this forum has a growing pervasive “protective” and “mom and pop” mentality
that minimizes its potential and growth.

Often, If you don’t fit into a certain characterization or narrow base of sign makers-- you’re just not accepted here. I feel sometimes it is almost like being in high school.

I for one would be very interested to learn, understand, and to communicate more about internal, big industry sign making. I think that would tremendously enhance the discussion and information on this forum.
 

oldgoatroper

Roper of Goats. Old ones.
I for one would be very interested to learn, understand, and to communicate more about internal, big industry sign making. I think that would tremendously enhance the discussion and information on this forum.


I would agree with this if the prospective member is actually willing to divulge and discuss aspects of their operations and not just be a sponge. i.e. a contributor, not just an information miner...
 

charissabuskirk

New Member
That they may have things to contribute that exceed any disadvantage their acceptance might carry with it.

Agree!! My vote is to let them in... if they are trying to join to help, or seek help then what makes them any different then anyone else? I may be missing something, but what disadvantages?
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
I take no offense to anyone disagreeing with me. That's why I posted my thoughts. At this point, I believe it's still open for discussion and/or debate. I doubt very much if a decision of this magnitude has to be decided by 5:30 EST. Just like the flights.... it can be canceled and we'll re-book them on Monday if need be.

My only concern is.... it is already against the rules and was seen as being a fit policy when putting this place together. New horizons and new rules are what progress is all about. However, starting it now with someone big.... should someone come in that Fred, his committee or the membership body here is against..... how can we stop it, once a precedence is created or has been established ??

Is there to be a limit as to how big a company can be to join... or how small ??

Before dancing a jog for someone of this nature to come aboard, I would think all the possibilities should be weighed out and be sure this is what s101 wants to do, or it could be shooting itself in the foot.
 

petepaz

New Member
I take no offense to anyone disagreeing with me.

are you sure? we didn't hurt your feelings?...hahaha just kidding, couldn't resist that one
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
:pops_blinking:



I don't get it ??








You can hurt my feelings you.......... prick.jpg














:ROFLMAO:
 

SignManiac

New Member
I don't care one way or the other. I'll help those I can help, and not worry about those I can't help. Aint never gonna stop people from wanting to get rich in the sign business. I say let them learn how difficult it is. And who knows, maybe some of them might just learn a few things.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
My only concern is.... it is already against the rules and was seen as being a fit policy when putting this place together. New horizons and new rules are what progress is all about. However, starting it now with someone big.... should someone come in that Fred, his committee or the membership body here is against..... how can we stop it, once a precedence is created or has been established ??

Is there to be a limit as to how big a company can be to join... or how small ??

As with many rules, they aren't perfect and gray areas can be challenging. Many of those challenging points have been stated by others in this thread already. The original intent was focused on local end users seeking to bypass the professional to save a buck. But it was all encompassing and has caused me to reject a number of applicants in the past that part of me was saying that it was a mistake to do so. Hence, this time I decided to get some feedback.

In the final analysis, a perfect system of screening will never be possible and the checks and balances are in the conduct of the new member or complaints by existing members. In addition, we are quite capable of modifying our rules at any time and reversing previous modifications if they don't work out as expected.
 

Techman

New Member
A sign shop for a big corp already has the skill sets to do their work. I do not see how they will come here to take away any thing from any body. I also know of one airline that has its own internal marketing and graphics dept. that outsources to outside shops. (like mine).

That is a good thing. Yes?
 

Si Allen

New Member
Let's face it ... the chance of you getting the work from a big corp with it's own sign shop is about 1%.

Their volume will probably too large for you to handle.

BUT the chance of getting some of their work, like what Techman stated, is enhanced if they are here and know some of us and our capabilities.
 

MikePro

New Member
curious how tight fisted the airline company will be with info... like a certain company chiming in on threads about edging in on the vehicle wrap marketing to car dealerships, just to disappear for weeks and come back with a management-approved response to concerns that never really answered the questions posted.
 

andy

New Member
Gino: I respectfully submit that I couldn’t disagree more with your opposition comments on this issue, and with the 11 who disapprove so far.

And I think this decision is very important.

I say let them in.

I feel that this forum has a growing pervasive “protective” and “mom and pop” mentality
that minimizes its potential and growth.

Often, If you don’t fit into a certain characterization or narrow base of sign makers-- you’re just not accepted here. I feel sometimes it is almost like being in high school.

I for one would be very interested to learn, understand, and to communicate more about internal, big industry sign making. I think that would tremendously enhance the discussion and information on this forum.

Working within the big sign making industry is NOT as hard as you think it is... there is NO magic formula and you don't need a Harvard MBA in management b0llocks.

What you need is a chance.... a lucky break which allows you to present you bona fides and your capabilities to a corporate buyer.

Any reputable sign business who knows what they are doing can deal with high end sign production; there are specialist sub contractors in the industry who's primary purpose is to allow you to punch above your weight.

What you cannot get, and will not have is the opportunity to even state your business case to a corporate buyer if said corporation has all the skills and capabilities you do. By educating the corporate buyer into the mysteries and inner workings of the sign industry all you are doing is rendering yourself redundant and irrelevant.

If large corporates and their in-house departments are allowed to wander through Signs101 cherry picking all the salient points and production fixes what advantage does that bring to the independent sign shop?

To say that you might as well let these corporates in because they'll do it anyway is utterly defeatest.... corporations can buy lots of machinery but from my perspective I want them to utterly fail. I want that expensive machinery to cause nothing but hassle, I want every project to be a cost over running. hideously expensive nightmare. At some stage I want an accountant from head office will notice the problem and give the in-house sign department the coup de gras.... thus immediately releasing a gushing spout of work which falls straight into the lap of independent sign companies.

If you think you'll never work for large corporations and act accordingly it becomes a self forfilling prophesy... you don't think you'll get the work so you merrily spout forth with helpful suggestions and production tips... the corporate shops devour your comments thus ensuring you NEVER will get that business changing break.

Since the advent of CAD CAM vinyl cutting this industry has both expanded hugely and splintered greatly. There are very few large sign companies left (at least in this country). Many really big sign projects are manufactured in their entirety in Eastern Europe or similar low cost country... in your case I should imagine Mexico is a prime candidate. The least we can do is protect what is left... squeezed by the low cost hobbiests at one end and the outsourcing mega corps at the other it's important to ensure that there is some tender, profitable meat on the bone with which to sustain us and our families.

Merchant members flogging machinery will love having corporate buyers with deep pockets but this is not, as far as I'm concerned in anyway positive for the professional independent shop.

Let corporates in by all means but this Turkey isn't going to be discussing Turkey based cookery tips anytime soon.
 

Techman

New Member
If large corporates and their in-house departments are allowed to wander through Signs101 cherry picking all the salient points and production fixes what advantage does that bring to the independent sign shop?

You think that individual sign technicians working in these corporate sponsored shops do not know what it takes to get any job done? Their technicians know as much as any body around. Their needs are pretty specific as well. But, they are going more to computer network controlled LCD displays. One operator selects a graphics file and send it to the server to be displayed all over the world.

Plus they will spend whatever it takes to get something done. They will pay whatever it takes to overcome any obstacle to getting the job done.
 

HulkSmash

New Member
I don't think it's too big of a deal. American Furniture warehouse has their own shop. They do all their own printing, newspapers, and commercials in the basement of one of their warehouses. I have done a few installs for them (Box Trucks / Semis) for wraps, and they're pretty easy to work with. They're in the same industry as us, so i see no problem with it.
 

charissabuskirk

New Member
If large corporates and their in-house departments are allowed to wander through Signs101 cherry picking all the salient points and production fixes what advantage does that bring to the independent sign shop?

What's the difference if they are members or not? Besides the premium section in which they would have to pay for like the rest of us, everything is out there for them already. You contradict yourself two statements later... what is there to be afraid of? I'm sure that if they have established themselves as a large corporation, that they didn't just jump willy-nilly into an in-house design/manufacturing division and hope it worked out for the best.
 

skyhigh

New Member
Large corporations have in-house sign departments, that's a fact of life, always has been and always will be. Everybody's right, they're still in this business.

That said, the lawn care companies or plumbing companies that bought a cat-named chinese plotter off of Ebay to cut the sign guy out shouldn't be here. But the in-house shops for airports, hospitals, amusement parks, etc. are no threat to us.

I was going to say "let them in" until this post got me thinking..... So whats the difference (except in scale) from the lawn care guy that was interested enough to buy a plotter, to the hospital that opened up a full service sign shop?

Alot have said, "No Threat to Us".....but opening up their own sign shop had to have cut SOMEONE's throat in this industry....... just not yours.

Unless we see some major discounted airline tickets :rolleyes: I'm leaning no.
 

omgsideburns

New Member
you let people from franchise sign shops on here.. corporate companies with in house is no different.

but me, i don't care. i'm a graphic designer who happens to work at a sign shop.
 
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