When someone asks..."Is that the best price you can give me?"

[Gino]

A sales and closing tactic I have used is. You quote a price on a quality item/job. The customer says.... can you do it for less. I politely say no, but we had a special last month and I can include a ( shiny silver clip ) for you at no extra charge or anything....... this way you still get the job. You include something that costs you 1.00 and has a perceived value of 10.99 or higher. they win and you win, because you get fullprice. And... you did not cut the price , .

Sorry, I've read this over several times and not quite sure what you are really saying ??

Sounds like you already gave your best price, but you're gonna offer up a trinket, charge 10 times what it's worth, therefore bamboozling the customer and that's supposed to make them feel nice & comfy ??​

 

[Jeremiah]

Let me put it this way, one price, your price. If they complain or try to knock you down in price , include an extra grommet, or something at the same price. NO Bamboozling. Just keep the price the same. Keep your business above water and YOU comfy and cozy.

 

[Gino]

So, I have a 48" x 120" 1-sided banner on 14oz scrim with full bleed and I quote, let's say.......$380.00 finished and they say it's too high, If I add 2 extra grommets,.... you think they'll say yes, suddenly ??

 

[Jeremiah]

Bottom line with me is I Dont change the quote after I gave the price to the customer and I dont do price match. I consider it bad business practice. I might include an extra with it, or change it to different material, that would be a new quote. but that's as far as I go.

 

[CanuckSigns]

I hate hagglers. I tell them the price that I give is carefully formulated to be competitive and still profitable and is the best that I can do with the given specs. I just had an older realtor come in yesterday..... asked to get a quote on (2) 24" x 24" double sided 3mm ACM signs with single color vinyl. I worked up a quick price for it and came to $45 each to layout the graphics and produce the signs since he did not have his logo as vector artwork. Told him if it was more than 2 signs they would be cheaper with quantity. He huffed around that he is getting sticker shock on the price of signage (must of had another sign company quote also) as he had a retired signmaker that was making them on the side for $18 each. He asked if I could do better on my price and I just about laughed and told him the blanks alone I sell for $14 each. If he can keep having that guy do them he better keep doing them cause he's giving them away. He said he would think about it........ so wasted 10-15 minutes of my day with unreasonable expectations. I keep thinking more and more about not having walk-ins and just doing appointments only and keeping the tire kickers from wasting my time. If throughout the day 4 people stop in and take 15 minutes each of your time you've killed an hour of your workday and usually it's while you are in the middle of something and you have to drop what you are doing.

you sell a 24"x24" piece of aluminum composite panel for $14? why? that doesn't even cover your time to cut it.

 

[TimToad]

I hate hagglers. I tell them the price that I give is carefully formulated to be competitive and still profitable and is the best that I can do with the given specs. I just had an older realtor come in yesterday..... asked to get a quote on (2) 24" x 24" double sided 3mm ACM signs with single color vinyl. I worked up a quick price for it and came to $45 each to layout the graphics and produce the signs since he did not have his logo as vector artwork. Told him if it was more than 2 signs they would be cheaper with quantity. He huffed around that he is getting sticker shock on the price of signage (must of had another sign company quote also) as he had a retired signmaker that was making them on the side for $18 each. He asked if I could do better on my price and I just about laughed and told him the blanks alone I sell for $14 each. If he can keep having that guy do them he better keep doing them cause he's giving them away. He said he would think about it........ so wasted 10-15 minutes of my day with unreasonable expectations. I keep thinking more and more about not having walk-ins and just doing appointments only and keeping the tire kickers from wasting my time. If throughout the day 4 people stop in and take 15 minutes each of your time you've killed an hour of your workday and usually it's while you are in the middle of something and you have to drop what you are doing.

We try to distinguish between the truly inexperienced sign purchaser and the haggler. We'll give a little hand holding to the inexperienced purchaser, but the obvious haggler types get minimum time investment on our part and get sent on their way.

I'm shocked at the prices you quoted for the 2'x2's but understand when you've had your local market polluted by some hack or fly by nighter, it's really tough to get what the work is worth. We'd be close to double what you quoted him.

What do you do a single sided 4'x8' on 3mm ACM for?

 

[GAC05]

So, I have a 48" x 120" 1-sided banner on 14oz scrim with full bleed and I quote, let's say.......$380.00 finished and they say it's too high, If I add 2 extra grommets,.... you think they'll say yes, suddenly ??

If they are designer hand made grommets from the Philippines, Yes!

 

[OhioSigns]

We try to distinguish between the truly inexperienced sign purchaser and the haggler. We'll give a little hand holding to the inexperienced purchaser, but the obvious haggler types get minimum time investment on our part and get sent on their way.

I'm shocked at the prices you quoted for the 2'x2's but understand when you've had your local market polluted by some hack or fly by nighter, it's really tough to get what the work is worth. We'd be close to double what you quoted him.

What do you do a single sided 4'x8' on 3mm ACM for?

This was just plotter cut vinyl using Oracal 651 and the logo was pretty simple. I usually don't do too much plotter cut stuff anymore but my pricing on a printed 3mm 4'x8' ACM single sided sign with customer supplied vector artwork would be $392 using 3M 40C/8518. 6mm ACM would be $512. Design time is billed separately.

As for the $14 for a blank. I have a 52" shear that cuts ACM like butter and also a panel saw. It takes just a couple seconds to cut blanks. I do quite a bit of safety signage on ACM and have blanks already cut to various sizes. I've got less than $1.50 / Sq. Ft. in 3mm ACM and selling it for $3.50 / Sq.Ft.

 

[TimToad]

This was just plotter cut vinyl using Oracal 651 and the logo was pretty simple. I usually don't do too much plotter cut stuff anymore but my pricing on a printed 3mm 4'x8' ACM single sided sign with customer supplied vector artwork would be $392 using 3M 40C/8518. 6mm ACM would be $512. Design time is billed separately.

As for the $14 for a blank. I have a 52" shear that cuts ACM like butter and also a panel saw. It takes just a couple seconds to cut blanks. I do quite a bit of safety signage on ACM and have blanks already cut to various sizes. I've got less than $1.50 / Sq. Ft. in 3mm ACM and selling it for $3.50 / Sq.Ft.

Ok, those numbers sound more realistic, but I still wonder about the 2'x2's.

If you get nearly $400 for a single sided 4'x8' with a print/lam and a 4'x8' yields 8 24"x24" signs @$45 each, that's only $360.00 for the 8 double sided signs with all that cutting, weeding and application time added on.

Seems like a lot of extra labor and vinyl for less money.

 

[equippaint]

Sorry, I've read this over several times and not quite sure what you are really saying ??

Sounds like you already gave your best price, but you're gonna offer up a trinket, charge 10 times what it's worth, therefore bamboozling the customer and that's supposed to make them feel nice & comfy ??​

Hey Gino, listen closely, you're learning B2B sales from a pro here

 

[Johnny Best]

I like the silver trinket story, Peter Minuit bought Manhattan from the Indians for $24 of trinkets.
I bet he said "is that the best price you can give me"?

 

[Pixels Are Bad Mmmkay?]

I'm shocked at the prices you quoted for the 2'x2's but understand when you've had your local market polluted by some hack or fly by nighter, it's really tough to get what the work is worth. We'd be close to double what you quoted him.

Ok, those numbers sound more realistic, but I still wonder about the 2'x2's.

If you get nearly $400 for a single sided 4'x8' with a print/lam and a 4'x8' yields 8 24"x24" signs @$45 each, that's only $360.00 for the 8 double sided signs with all that cutting, weeding and application time added on.

Seems like a lot of extra labor and vinyl for less money.

I'm glad you mentioned it so I didn't have to. We'd be at around double that price as well. $45 is closer to what we'd charge for a 2' x 2' single sided sign.

We always price our panels at 1/4 sheet, half sheet, or full sheet price, regardless of the size. So a 24" x 24" panel would be calculated as requiring a 1/4 sheet of material, anything up to 48" x 48", for example even something like a 30" x 30", would be calculated as a half sheet of material, and anything over a half sheet size, even something as small as a 54" x 30" would be calculated as a full sheet of material. In other words, anything that's a remnant, drop, off-cut or whatever you want to call it is pretty well accounted for in our pricing.

 

[TimToad]

I'm glad you mentioned it so I didn't have to. We'd be at around double that price as well. $45 is closer to what we'd charge for a 2' x 2' single sided sign.

We always price our panels at 1/4 sheet, half sheet, or full sheet price, regardless of the size. So a 24" x 24" panel would be calculated as requiring a 1/4 sheet of material, anything up to 48" x 48", for example even something like a 30" x 30", would be calculated as a half sheet of material, and anything over a half sheet size, even something as small as a 54" x 30" would be calculated as a full sheet of material. In other words, anything that's a remnant, drop, off-cut or whatever you want to call it is pretty well accounted for in our pricing.

We have a slightly different approach but feel it works for us pretty consistently. I really like your system as well and will test against ours on the next few jobs and see how they compare.

Of course, everything we're discussing is for standard "layout" type signs, not a design heavy, all tricked out, project type sign.

We take a 4'x8' and have a somewhat set square footage price for it. Every cut into it adds between $1.50-$2.00 per square foot. The smaller the sign the higher per square foot price. For double sided signs we take the 100% price for the first side and then add 60% of that for the second side. I think I came up with $88.50 for a double sided 2'x2' on 3mm ACM.

 

[GAC05]

Kind of funny - after my reply to Gino on the grommets . Today we picked up a roll of banner from a local supplier and as part of introducing the new material - we received a free...... bag of grommets.

 

[JTBoh]

Just about any car salesman will tell you that's the opposite tactic. You get their budget, you show them a vehicle right at the tippy top of the budget and then tell them there is a vehicle that's got just a few more features for just a similar monthly price. They're happy they got an awesome car close to their budget, and you made more money that you would have. You never want to start at the top and work down, because this can cause all sorts of negative emotions that will lower your chance of a sell.

Almost none of what I do comes from the "car salesman" school of sales. I'm information based - I give them the options they need to make an informed decision. I don't push, I suggest, and back up my suggestion with my experience and knowledge about the trade. It builds trust to work down from the top - it takes it away when you're always trying to push for a few extra bucks off of them. If they can afford the Caddy, all the better for you - and you don't have to work up to it by making asks of the customer.

One of my main sales tenets is "You can't sell a sign - they have to need it". If someone needs a sign, they're more likely to spend on it to get what they want.
Maybe that philosophy is a product of what I sell - I focus on primary buildouts, monument signs, and illuminated stuff - but it works well for our company and my bank account. My conversion ratio isn't suffering.

 

[Deco Indy]

I have two thoughts:

People often equate quality/value with price. I give volume discounts, but never on a single item.

Secondly, I explain that my product/craft is high quality. I then advise them if it is too pricey, I will completely understand if the need to find it cheaper.

I used to chase the business, but it only gave me heartache and frustration. I shop the competition so I know where I stand as far as pricing. Have confidence in yourself and your craft and you need never second guess what you are charging.

 

[TimToad]

I have two thoughts:

People often equate quality/value with price. I give volume discounts, but never on a single item.

Secondly, I explain that my product/craft is high quality. I then advise them if it is too pricey, I will completely understand if the need to find it cheaper.

I used to chase the business, but it only gave me heartache and frustration. I shop the competition so I know where I stand as far as pricing. Have confidence in yourself and your craft and you need never second guess what you are charging.

Can I ask how you "shop the competition" without divulging your identity or potentially building resentment about you wasting their time if discovered?

 

[bannertime]

Almost none of what I do comes from the "car salesman" school of sales. I'm information based - I give them the options they need to make an informed decision. I don't push, I suggest, and back up my suggestion with my experience and knowledge about the trade. It builds trust to work down from the top - it takes it away when you're always trying to push for a few extra bucks off of them. If they can afford the Caddy, all the better for you - and you don't have to work up to it by making asks of the customer.

One of my main sales tenets is "You can't sell a sign - they have to need it". If someone needs a sign, they're more likely to spend on it to get what they want.
Maybe that philosophy is a product of what I sell - I focus on primary buildouts, monument signs, and illuminated stuff - but it works well for our company and my bank account. My conversion ratio isn't suffering.

Whether it's car sales, appliance, pens, or scams, it's all the same. What may work for you, is all fine and dandy, but it could still be better. Philosophy doesn't have anything against decades upon decades of sales studies. Down-selling can have negative affects to a customer's emotions and can cause them to walk away out of shame or embarrassment. It's never a good method to start with. It's like a last resort, for when you failed to manage their expectations. Managing customer's expectations is different in that you actually move their purchase parameters and not just selling them something else.

 

[Deco Indy]

Can I ask how you "shop the competition" without divulging your identity or potentially building resentment about you wasting their time if discovered?

I have friends who gone to other shops and gotten quotes for various jobs. I never worry about wasting other people's time in this way. I'm sure there are others shopping me also. If you aren't doing comps, you may be completely out of line with what the community is willing to pay.

I'm not saying I base my prices solely off this method, but it gives a reference for the area. I believe clients come for the prices, but stay for the quality and customer service. My prices are fair and my quality good and service is great. I use comps for reference. I never bad mouth another shop and have respect for what they do. I think there is enough water in the lake for us all to drink.

 

[Gino]

Not if you're around Lake Mead.........................

I understand what you're doing and while it sounds good, you're running a very dangerous method of doing business. It's fine to know what and how your competitors are conducting business and even what they are charging, but to compare your prices and then perhaps shave some off and show them your quality or top notch craftsmanship..... well, that's just not good. You need to get what YOU need to get to keep YOUR doors open, not theirs. Regardless of your low or high overhead vs. whatever theirs is to size of shop and employees to equipment will all play a part of your quoted dollar.

If someone has some machines which can out produce and give better quality than what you have, they may sell for a little less than you, just to drive YOU out of business. There are people around like that. They don't care what the level of the pond is.... they simply want you outta the way.

I know what my competition can output, I know how and I know their pricing, but I don't really care. Like you said, there's enough business out there, it's just keeping what you have, do it right and put money in the bank every night. As for getting new people away from your competition, it they're shopping around, just be honest and give it your best shot. Giving in will only yield some bad press and perhaps force you to cut quality or corners. Is that the kinda reputation you wanna build.... or already have ??​