Yo......... Canadians..................

[Marlene]

my husband is an English speaking Canadian who lived in Quebec. what a hellish place to live when you are an English speaker! when we got married, we had to have paper work from Quebec for the INS. it was all in French. me being an American told him to get it done in English as that is what we needed. they, of course would not as it is the official language of Quebec so we had to pay for an approved translation into English. he was truned down for job promotions because he was English and couldn't speak French and was treated poorly most of the time by the French. I am sorry to offend any of our French Canadians but I've seen first hand just how much it rots to be English speaking in Quebec! who cares who got there first? Vermont had the same folks who founded Quebec found us too but you don't find us clinging onto that.

 

[signmeup]

Canada celebrates it's mixed heritage while the US is the great melting pot. Quebec is full of wonderful people. A few radicals there make it a bit tough on all the rest by force feeding their culture to everyone. Any culture that is so wonderful will sustain itself without artificial support. This should go NHB now... (wait for it...)

 

[genericname]

I am sorry to offend any of our French Canadians but I've seen first hand just how much it rots to be English speaking in Quebec!

No offence taken; it's how French speaking Canadians are treated just about everywhere else in Canada.

I'm with you on the "who cares who came first" front. If it really mattered who was hear first, we'd all be speaking Cris, Objibway, and Algonquin.

I'm pleasantly surprised by how civil this conversation has been, and how willing all us Canucks are to speak openly and frankly about something that's arguably the most politically charged, ongoing subject in the country.

Whatever your political stance, first recognize that we are sign makers and communicators. Language is a tool, and the more tools you can add to your arsenal, the more footing you have over your competitors, and the more money you can make.

It doesn't matter if bilingualism becomes a federal policy, which I doubt will ever happen in the 'States, as the individual States themselves would never allow it. What does matter, is that this, like anything else, can provide you with an opportunity to increase and expand your business. Turn lemons into lemonade!

 

[SebastienL]

Gabagoo.. Jacques Cartier was the first European here, in 1534.

Québec city was the first city founded.




Yes, francophones are picky about their langage, but we have fought to keep speaking french for hundreds of years know, and I don't beleive we are about to quit.

As far langages go, I think there are as many francophones in Québec that don't speak english as there are anglophones in the rest of Canada that don't speak french. I consider myself perfectly bilingual... although I do have an accent when speaking english. I know some of these one tongued people hate the other with vehemance... but to me, that's just a sign of ignorance. Wether or not you speak the other langage, you should be able to respect the other culture.

Living right on the Ontario/Québec border, I have to deal with the french/english on the same sign dilemma on a daily basis. For example, we do a lot a work for the NCC, who manage all the federal parks in Ottawa/Gatineau. Most of the time, that means swithching the text around so french is above english for signs that goes on the Québec side and vice-versa for the ones that are for the Ontario side.

Federal employees get an $800 bonus each year if they are bilingual.

There is a law in québec that says french must be prominent, but none that says other languages must be in X% in size compared to french... so a lot of room to play with, and a lot of room for debate.

I'm sorry if anglophones feel prejudiced in Québec, but I'm sure a lot of francophones feel the same way in other provinces.

All that being said, I think Canada is a stronger Country being bilingual...
Switzerland, I think, has 5 official languages... They seem to be able to deal with it peacefully... we should be able to deal with 2.

 

[HulkSmash]

Your Mom is so dumb that she tried to minimize a 12 variable function to a minimal sum of products expression using a Karnaugh map instead of the Quine-McCluskey algorithm


....oops! I thought this thread was "Yo Comedians"

fail.

 

[signmeup]

Gabagoo.. Jacques Cartier was the first European here, in 1534.

Québec city was the first city founded.




Yes, francophones are picky about their langage, but we have fought to keep speaking french for hundreds of years know, and I don't beleive we are about to quit.

As far langages go, I think there are as many francophones in Québec that don't speak english as there are anglophones in the rest of Canada that don't speak french. I consider myself perfectly bilingual... although I do have an accent when speaking english. I know some of these one tongued people hate the other with vehemance... but to me, that's just a sign of ignorance. Wether or not you speak the other langage, you should be able to respect the other culture.

Living right on the Ontario/Québec border, I have to deal with the french/english on the same sign dilemma on a daily basis. For example, we do a lot a work for the NCC, who manage all the federal parks in Ottawa/Gatineau. Most of the time, that means swithching the text around so french is above english for signs that goes on the Québec side and vice-versa for the ones that are for the Ontario side.

Federal employees get an $800 bonus each year if they are bilingual.

There is a law in québec that says french must be prominent, but none that says other languages must be in X% in size compared to french... so a lot of room to play with, and a lot of room for debate.

I'm sorry if anglophones feel prejudiced in Québec, but I'm sure a lot of francophones feel the same way in other provinces.

All that being said, I think Canada is a stronger Country being bilingual...
Switzerland, I think, has 5 official languages... They seem to be able to deal with it peacefully... we should be able to deal with 2.

Not even close. There are about 4 million "French only" in Quebec out of a population of 7.4 million. Canada has 35 million people, most of whom can not speak French. (somewhere between two and four percent of Canadians speak French as their regular language.)

 

[SebastienL]

Not even close. There are about 4 million "French only" in Quebec out of a population of 7.4 million. Canada has 35 million people, most of whom can not speak French.

I was talking percentage... and you'd probably be suprised as how many anglophones, when push comes to shove, can actually understand french.

 

[signmeup]

I was talking percentage... and you'd probably be suprised as how many anglophones, when push comes to shove, can actually understand french.

Yeah... that works both ways you know. I'm willing to bet that most of the "French only" Quebecers can understand English just fine.

 

[signmeup]

Here's what irks me about this French vs English crap. I'm not English. I speak English but I'm Canadian... and damn proud of it too. English people live in England. French people live in France. Canadians live in Canada. End of problem.

 

[genericname]

Nipping this in the bud before we all get sand kicked in our eyes.

From Wikipedia:
"English and French are the first languages of 59.7 and 23.2 percent of the population respectively. Approximately 98 percent of Canadians speak English or French: 57.8% speak English only, 22.1% speak French only, and 17.4% speak both."

Now let's put that pettiness aside. Percentage doesn't mean anyone "wins", as this is no contest.

 

[Marlene]

I think the problem is that it is not really bilingual, it is an either or so those who don't can't read a sign, talk to a doctor, get there records or much of anything else no matter which, English or French you speak. if there are two official languages, OK but respect that both need to be used and not just one of them in certain places. I guess I am really slanted in my views because of my husband and his family and their experiences. I don't want to come across as anti-French as I am not and don't mean to insult any of our members who are.

 

[SebastienL]

Yeah... that works both ways you know. I'm willing to bet that most of the "French only" Quebecers can understand English just fine.

You're absolutely right!

All in all though, I think you'll agree, it's not even whether or not you speak one or both languages... it's about whether or not you have an open mind.

 

[Gino]

No offence taken; it's how French speaking Canadians are treated just about everywhere else in Canada.

I'm with you on the "who cares who came first" front. If it really mattered who was hear first, we'd all be speaking Cris, Objibway, and Algonquin.

I'm pleasantly surprised by how civil this conversation has been, and how willing all us Canucks are to speak openly and frankly about something that's arguably the most politically charged, ongoing subject in the country.

Whatever your political stance, first recognize that we are sign makers and communicators. Language is a tool, and the more tools you can add to your arsenal, the more footing you have over your competitors, and the more money you can make.

It doesn't matter if bilingualism becomes a federal policy, which I doubt will ever happen in the 'States, as the individual States themselves would never allow it. What does matter, is that this, like anything else, can provide you with an opportunity to increase and expand your business. Turn lemons into lemonade !

I couldn't agree more.



I first posted this thread in order to find out how a country that has come to grips with some differences as basic as speaking/language barriers has dealt with it from long ago... up til the present.

This seems to be a history lesson which always fascinated me and I'd rather hear from your mouths... from people I can actually talk to than on-line where things are very biased.

I also realize this could almost be considered NHB, but applaud you all for keeping it civil.

My concern is how you dealt and deal with it over all the years vs how it's being forced on us in the lower 50 rather suddenly. It seems you were all there at the same time [within reason] and continued to speak in your native tongue. As your country grew and expanded... it would seem as if English might've taken over. Not to let anyone feel left out.... all municipalities were left to decide on their own.

Here, it seems for the most part, we have a sector of society which is unwilling to adapt to anything as all others have in the past over the last few 100 years. Our bilingual situation seems to be mandatory and unfair. There's no middle ground as in your country where you all work together. Sure, some people slip through he cracks and you'll have some hardship stories such as Marlene's or some others, but this down here seems to be a type of take-over deal and we don't have a say in our own country's destiny.

Thanks again for keeping this civil and sort of a history class.

Oh yeah.... about the Indians and Vikings and stuff. We're all taught that in school. I was trying to have more of an up-to-date discussion about these matters as it pertains to what has transpired over the years and how it affects you now from decisions made over time.
​

 

[Tim Aucoin]

Here's what irks me about this French vs English crap. I'm not English. I speak English but I'm Canadian... and damn proud of it too. English people live in England. French people live in France. Canadians live in Canada. End of problem.

 

[signmeup]

You're absolutely right!

All in all though, I think you'll agree, it's not even whether or not you speak one or both languages... it's about whether or not you have an open mind.

Just so you guys realize that you are not French and that we are not English. I have many French speaking friends. (actually they are bilingual)

An interesting side note: I was born in Quebec to English immigrants. But I'm still not English!! I'm Canadian.

 

[WrapperX]

Your Mom is so dumb that she tried to minimize a 12 variable function to a minimal sum of products expression using a Karnaugh map instead of the Quine-McCluskey algorithm


....oops! I thought this thread was "Yo Comedians"

fail.

Now that's funny!

 

[Baz]

Just so you guys realize that you are not French and that we are not English. I have many French speaking friends. (actually they are bilingual)

An interesting side note: I was born in Quebec to English immigrants. But I'm still not English!! I'm Canadian.

I am French Canadian!

Carefull Adrian i'm at the airport on my way to Moncton NB as i type this

 

[Gino]

Just so you guys realize that you are not French and that we are not English. I have many French speaking friends. (actually they are bilingual)

An interesting side note: I was born in Quebec to English immigrants. But I'm still not English!! I'm Canadian.

Hah........

Down here no matter what your ancestry was or is...... as long as you were born here, you're considered a United states citizen, but we're called Americans. Why that doesn't work if you're from Uruguay or some other country from this hemisphere is beyond me as to how we coined the phrase........ 'Americans'. Now, that only works based on what your situation is.

You see, we have Black/Americans, Afro/Americans, Spanglish, German/Americans, Italian/Americans, French/Americans and just about every other country with /American behind it.

We have parties and holidays all year long because every group brings their traditions along from the old country and it turns into a drinkfest for us.... Americans.

 

[Zazzess]

WoW I'm impressed by this conversation !

I want to personally thank all of you for the info and care you bring to this conversation !

I personally usually speak french but I do not speak perfectly either french or english... Baby I lived in calgary and moved to Quebec City till then...


I often think in english when I explain myself so people don't always get me the first time... lol

I always made big syntax mistakes
I always did better in english classes then french ones...

How funny right !!

Well !! I don't care who came here first ! I'm sure the vikings came here before the french and you know !! Indians were there !!

One more thing ! Even speaking french I know people don't understand each other just because they come from different cities !!
There are so many accents !!

I know english people here that don't try to speak french... others that hardly do... others easily speak both.... and french that don't speak a word english...

I know some haters from both sides... And I know some more open minded (no offense)

They can all hang out together ! RESPECT !!

When it comes to signs... I'm happy when its english or french at least...

Do you know english would be the easiest to learn and french would be of the toughest ?? I heard that several times.

I don't think we should force people into some language and I'm sure we all have to learn from each other

Don't most of the languages come from greek and latin !?!

Maybe what will come next is... no more words into signs !! Only icons

Who knows I hope we'll find I good way to communicate respectfully

 

[WrapperX]

I think our problem in the lower 48 and probably the entire 50 States is that we've become a society where we MUST accomadate others. If we don't we are considered to be offensive or racist or some other from of predejudice stigma. If we require all citzens to at least speak English we are intollerant of other cultures. We have become a countyr OBSESSED with Political Correctness to the point where you can't hardly have a differing opinion with out the ACLU getting involved.

Personally as an American born citizen who only speaks English, I personally find it offensive that I have to read other languages on a package of whatever. If I moved to Italy or Germany or where ever, it would be the right thing to do to learn the native language - especially if I was going to be there for a extended period of time. I wouldn't expect the country to start posting English signs just because I live there and can't speak the native tongue. But for reason of our own doing, we can't expect that from others.