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Am I the crazy one?

Discussion in 'General Signmaking Topics' started by thinksigns, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. thinksigns

    thinksigns SnowFlake

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    Nov 28, 2010
    So I sent the attached sample (the copy has been changed obviously) and it was approved by the landlord and tenant. They requested two lines of copy, so that is why the layout is like this. They are now claiming the letters are too small and they want me to do a 2nd set at a discount. They already pay a ridiculously low price ($50 for the letters and 1-hour round trip for the install). I offered to give them a 20% discount on the re-do or to send the new letters by courier to them for $15 and they would do the new install. How would you handle this and do you think the sample is sufficient for them to be able to tell what it would look like when completed. They are saying the sample wasn't good enough.
     

    Attached Files:

    Tags:
  2. JgS

    JgS Member

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    It seems too small of a job to offer a very big discount. How much more work cold you get from them? If they have another job for you you could save them the travel expense.
     
  3. Locals Find!

    Locals Find! Very Active Member

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    The sample isn't good enough as it gives no reference to scale.

    Whenever I make a sample like this I give reference to the dimensions of the graphic and where it is being mounted so they can understand what they are looking at.

    You should re-do this one for free you screwed up giving them that as a proof.
     
  4. thinksigns

    thinksigns SnowFlake

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    They average about an order per month, but they don't want to wait for another tenant to move in before fixing this.
     
  5. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    the reference to scale is that it is layed out on the door....
     
  6. thinksigns

    thinksigns SnowFlake

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    It's on an image of the door.
     
  7. Rick

    Rick Certified Enneadecagon Designer

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    On every layout, It's done to a scale so they can check it themselves,
    I have a door similar to yours, then add a scale person and the lettering
    size called out.

    I think it's a matter of...
    Will you get more work from these people?
    Then, stop charging them such a low price unless it's to your advantage

    If I had my drawing with all the tools they needed to simulate the size...
    they signed off on it, they would get no discount. That's what a proof is for.
     
  8. JgS

    JgS Member

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    They get a new tenant once a month? I would offer to replace it for free if they can bring you out for another job. Maybe they have something in mind they want.
     
  9. Locals Find!

    Locals Find! Very Active Member

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    Ok, listen up. I admit to posting some dumb things on here from time to time. That statement however, is the stupidest reasoning I have ever heard.

    What size door? How tall? How wide? What is the width & height of the glass? How tall is the lettering 2" or 3" ?? Really, these are things that need to be on a proof.

    Your proof is the equivalent of my kid drawing a sign with some crayons and going here is your proof of what your sign will look like, is that ok?

    Man up and be a professional you have the tools & knowledge ,I would hope, since you can apparently draw a door and add lettering to it. So, you decided to cut some corners being lazy or just forgetful and it bit you in the ***. So, swallow your pride accept you screwed up and make it right.
     
  10. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    on the image of THE door <--- would mean a to-scale drawing of THE CLIENTS DOOR
     
  11. FireSprint.com

    FireSprint.com Trade Only Screen & Digital Sign Printing

    This.

    I would ask if you can replace it while you're out there on another job, and replace it free of charge. It's not a matter of who's right or wrong here, it's a matter of how important your customers are to you. This one sounds like a steady, loyal customer albeit a small one. Don't tarnish your good reputation with this (and their referrals) for a $50 job.

    In the end, its our job as professionals to set the expectations. I don't see any problem with your proof, but somehow the customer just didn't get it.

    We have reprinted $500 jobs before, when it wasn't even our fault - just to save our good name. (Our average job is only about $125) There's a cost of doing business, and you have to decide how high that cost can go before you should walk away politely. On this one, $50 and an hour of time to me seems like a bargain to keep your customers loyal.
     
  12. CanuckSigns

    CanuckSigns Very Active Member

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    Be quiet! The way he did it is perfectly acceptable. The door gives a great reference point in terms of size

    God you're annoying sometimes
     
  13. TyrantDesigner

    TyrantDesigner Art! Hot and fresh.

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    Door is the scale, assuming 3 inch extruded metal frame and an average door that is ADA compliant ... you're looking at about ... what ... 1.5"x20" text on the top and 1.5"x12" text on the bottom? maybe a quarter inch stripe between?

    Seriously.

    Other than including actual measurements on the file, which still doesn't help some people ... he's spot on.

    OP, that should be adequate ... probably next time include measurements along with the proof somehow (in the e-mail, on the phone, etc) but otherwise, the discount you offered seems reasonable.
     
  14. player

    player Major Contributor

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    I think you did fine with the layout, but would be best to just do it again, free, asap.

    It sucks, but add a bit to the new jobs to make up for it over the year.
     
  15. Rick

    Rick Certified Enneadecagon Designer

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    Ummm, take is easy man...

    Though I agree in principle that it needs some measurement.
    If the door in the drawing represents the door on the property
    it's adequate for some chump $50.00 job for MOST clients.

    It's the occasional client that can't "visualize" the copy and either
    need some photo rendering (c'mon now, it's 50 bucks, really?)
    Or the copy full-size printed out... ain't happening unless there
    is a potential for more money

    Out of habit, I add all my measurements and a scale person and
    it's in an architectural scale. But that takes time. This job is
    a money loser from the start. The door usually is fine.
     
  16. Techman

    Techman Major Contributor

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    Do you sell real Estate?
     
  17. thinksigns

    thinksigns SnowFlake

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    I can now die happy. Adtechia has accused me of using the stupidest reasoning he has ever heard.

    I have decided to go ahead and replace it at no charge to keep a loyal customer.

    In my opinion, the sample on the door is better than telling them the height of the letters. Ask someone to show you 6" and see what wide variety you get. :)
    Next time I'll have both.
     
  18. Locals Find!

    Locals Find! Very Active Member

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    I am not talking about going so far as architectural scale but, really it's not hard to give some reference points.

    This took me about 2 minutes using Paint of all things.
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Rick

    Rick Certified Enneadecagon Designer

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    This is where your lack of knowledge is showing...

    If it's to an architectural scale... either in Corel or Illustrator with CADTools.

    You can add the EXACT measurements in seconds using the scale tools in either program.
     
  20. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    I still think a visual representation (which it is) is MUCH better than a few numbers...
     
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