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Completely New and I just bought a vinyl plotter!
- Thread starter bensmeding
- Start date
grafixemporium
New Member
With all due respect Fred, you should take another look at the image this site is portraying. The name of the site itself seems to indicate that this is a site for those new to the industry. I'm completely sure you realize that "101" is a classification for entry level college classes. Why then would you be so surprised that newbies come here looking for information and advice? Why is it necessary for you to lead by example and make a mockery of the guy in the thread? By doing that, you have just stamped your seal of approval on the very behavior that you and your mods hand out "infactions" for.
To those of your who are business owners or managers, if you have an issue to discuss with one of your employees, you would let him have it in front of everyone else in the shop? Or would you handle it like a professional and take them into a private office? This is really not that different.
I would think by now, if you really get as many bogus members as you say you do, that you would have a simple copy+paste form letter that you email out when you cancel an unqualified membership. Work smarter not harder.
To those of your who are business owners or managers, if you have an issue to discuss with one of your employees, you would let him have it in front of everyone else in the shop? Or would you handle it like a professional and take them into a private office? This is really not that different.
I would think by now, if you really get as many bogus members as you say you do, that you would have a simple copy+paste form letter that you email out when you cancel an unqualified membership. Work smarter not harder.
cdiesel
New Member
Gfx: I really hope you don't think that all newbies are treated unfairly here. People who are new to this industry, but are genuinely trying to make a living and better themselves are very welcome here, receive a lot of help, and ultimately develop into contributors themselves.
The people who are not welcome here are the hobbyists, do it yourselfers like you see in this instance.
I think Fred is handling this (and every other issue I've ever been privy to) very professionally. Instead of automatically hitting the ban button, he's giving the guy a chance to prove himself.
The OP has upgraded his equipment. Great. He has still, however, not addressed any of the other questions other members have asked.
The people who are not welcome here are the hobbyists, do it yourselfers like you see in this instance.
I think Fred is handling this (and every other issue I've ever been privy to) very professionally. Instead of automatically hitting the ban button, he's giving the guy a chance to prove himself.
The OP has upgraded his equipment. Great. He has still, however, not addressed any of the other questions other members have asked.
grafixemporium
New Member
That's ridiculous Signage. Besides, it doesn't matter what your intentions are with a brand or image... it really only matters how it is perceived. In this case, whether you like it or not, Signs 101 implies "Signs for Beginners".
grafixemporium
New Member
LMAO... here we go... another PREMIUM SUBSCRIBER going right for the personal attacks. Grow up.
cdiesel
New Member
Out of curiosity, I went and looked at the newbie forum to see how many newbies are treated as badly as is being implied.. Didn't count how many threads were on the first page, maybe 20? (that's all I read--figured it'd be a good sampling) and there was exactly one thread where the OP was jumped on. Wouldn't you know, he was doing this "on the side, and makes plenty of money at his real job".
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
First off, I didn't name this site. At the time I "inherited" it, most of the 400 members disappeared because all that it was being used for was file swapping. The founder, BTW, never mentioned that he had run up some advertising bills with the trade magazines that he had no intention of paying. In those days, Signs 101 was a virtual ghost town. So I led by example and engaged in open discussions with those who still came around. Much of the advice they gave then and continued, along with others, contributed heavily into the evolved version that exists today.
The name, however, remained because it does fit the mission of the site and the community. And just as you said:
that is true. Our mission is to help all members who wish to earn all or part of their livings making signs and other graphic products. What isn't true is that this same information and advice should be freely handed out to individuals who have no interest in producing signs for others in return for payment. You seem to equate legitimate newbies with any information seeker that visits here. I don't and neither do the primary contributors of information and help at Signs 101. We do seek to limit to the greatest extent possible the useful information available to non-professionals who come here seeking it.
As to perception, if I based my conduct on worrying about your perception or that of others who may well be guilty of "just not getting it", I would just close the doors here. You and others who like to take me to task for my decisions and choices do so with no clue of the many things that do go on in private and just how infuriating and counter productive such casually given generalized judgments are.
And how many infractions do you think we give out? Or, after nine years, how many members have been banned? Let me enlighten you:
Since 2003, the total number of infractions issued here can be counted on one's fingers and toes with a foot full of toes and then some left unused. But on a daily basis, there are around 15 to 20 things that happen here that end up being moderated in some way. In nearly every case, the member is sent a PM explaining what was done and why.
Since 2003, we have banned less members here than were banned at Signs 201 in the first four weeks of its existence.
The total number of threads in which a new member is accused of not meeting our membership criteria and/or is treated rudely is a minuscule percentage of the responses and treatment of new members as a whole. And, in the majority of cases, the members accusing and/or being rude are correct in their perceptions.
We currently process between 20 and 30 new member registrations a day. They are screened and extra time is spent in verifying the truthfulness of their statements. Each receives an email from me as to the outcome of their application. Among those that are rejected, some reply with some of the nastiest filth and bad manners you could imagine. In short, I spend a major part of my day playing gatekeeper and moderator in an effort to keep Signs 101 the success it has evolved into and continuing to meet its mission to help professionals in the business be better at what they do and more profitable as well.
My confronting and questioning the OP had everything to do with my role as gatekeeper here. I chose to do so in public to make the same point to hundreds of other non-professionals at the same time and to make clear to existing members that there is a continuing effort to live up to the mission that was agreed to a couple of years back by several hundred of our most active and helpful members.
In closing, your criticisms, suggestions and observations are incorrect, based on not having enough information, invalid, confused and insulting. Your perception of what you think Signs 101 is and/or should be are your own and not shared by me or by most of our members.
GypsyGraphics
New Member
I Talked to Signwarehoue today and they upgraded me too a graphtec fc8000 48" cutter and Lti Master Plus. Cant wait to get it! Little hefty price tag, but they say its good!
wow that's great! good choice too! (better than mine)
now you can working in Illustrator and send it directly to the cutter.
i did say welcome in my first post... but it wasn't my usual
warm welcome from sunny california
and i'm sorry for that... i get a little silly in the wee hours... it's best just to ignore me after 10pm or so... and by 3am, well we won't even go there.
eek... it's after 10 already! hurry hurry hit submit! aaaand now i'm talking to myself. see what i mean.
grafixemporium
New Member
Since we're apparently going to continue this in a public forum...
I must say, I feel privileged to have earned one of the 10 to 15 infractions that you say have ever been handed out at S101. If you go review the thread I was given the infraction for, you'll find that it is a thread strikingly similar to this one.
http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?p=754871#post754871
Even now, you're coming at me like I'm the bad guy and you have something to prove. Don't you have anything better to do than try to "educate" me? I don't need the education. I'm good.
Let me be clear, I don't want Joe Nascar here learning about our trade anymore than the next guy. But you need to figure out your protocol for handling these situations and stick to it. Don't hand out infractions to some and let all the other negativity slide.
For the record, I appreciate most of the members of S101. I have learned a ton and shared an equal amount of information in my time here. The type of crap in this thread and many others like it is unnecessary and should be dealt with... or not. But to pick and choose who you are going to infract or threaten to ban for no good reason isn't right.
Regards,
Andrew
I must say, I feel privileged to have earned one of the 10 to 15 infractions that you say have ever been handed out at S101. If you go review the thread I was given the infraction for, you'll find that it is a thread strikingly similar to this one.
http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?p=754871#post754871
Even now, you're coming at me like I'm the bad guy and you have something to prove. Don't you have anything better to do than try to "educate" me? I don't need the education. I'm good.
Let me be clear, I don't want Joe Nascar here learning about our trade anymore than the next guy. But you need to figure out your protocol for handling these situations and stick to it. Don't hand out infractions to some and let all the other negativity slide.
For the record, I appreciate most of the members of S101. I have learned a ton and shared an equal amount of information in my time here. The type of crap in this thread and many others like it is unnecessary and should be dealt with... or not. But to pick and choose who you are going to infract or threaten to ban for no good reason isn't right.
Regards,
Andrew
CentralSigns
New Member
How did you get an infection from saying that? You had to have been sic already.
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
To be clear ... I did not issue that infraction. Further, in a private exchange with the Admin who did, I explained to him how I would have handled it and it would not have been to issue the infraction.
I'm not "coming at you". I'm responding to a rather broad set of claims, observations and criticisms you've leveled at me. I do it here in an open forum because you have leveled your posts at me in this open forum. I also do it because it represents an opportunity to communicate policy, reasoning, and background information to all who read it. I have no need to educate you but I do feel that 1) I should not let your statements go unanswered and 2) others will have a clearer understanding of these matters as a result of my replies.
Beyond that, I'm just delighted that you "appreciate most of the members of S101" and that you've "learned a ton and shared an equal amount of information in my time here". That ought to be worth some benefit of the doubt regarding your perceptions going forward.
All the best,
Fred
Forget about many of the BS postings so far.
There is a difference in approach and "newbies" should use their brains and approach with the right approach from the start.
Original post:
Hi, I just bought this,
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-44-SignMaker...t_10787wt_1139
Is it any good?
I own a business and i make a lot of signs for internal use, will it be good for that?
Also can I use about illustator as my design program? or what do you recommend?
Will this program, FlexiSign Vinyl Express LXi Apprentice Software allow me to do a lot of cool designs?
Better option?
Hi all my name is XXXXX from XXXXX I have been in the motor trade for many years but things are slow, so considering branching out into something that might encompass my abilities and equipment. I have always liked signs.
My Uncle a few States away seems to do quite well from the industry. I intend tapping into his knowledge but I am sure there is more that many here may help with.
I was considering this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-44-SignMaker...t_10787wt_1139
Wondering... Is it any good? Is it entry level? How long should this last in a growth curve?
I make a lot of signs for internal use, hopefully it be good for that and the start of what no doubt will be a steep learning curve.
Also - any suggestions as to whether can I use Illustator successfully as my design program? Alternative suggestions?
I am also considering FlexiSign Vinyl Express LXi Apprentice Software. Hopefully this will allow me to do a lot of cool designs for potential customers.
I also realise that garbage in is garbage out so I have a lot to learn not just in cutting, but the design process.
Any help / suggestions would certainly be appreciated.
Ben
Hope this helps SOMEONE - ANYONE...LOL
Cheers - G
There is a difference in approach and "newbies" should use their brains and approach with the right approach from the start.
Original post:
Hi, I just bought this,
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-44-SignMaker...t_10787wt_1139
Is it any good?
I own a business and i make a lot of signs for internal use, will it be good for that?
Also can I use about illustator as my design program? or what do you recommend?
Will this program, FlexiSign Vinyl Express LXi Apprentice Software allow me to do a lot of cool designs?
Better option?
Hi all my name is XXXXX from XXXXX I have been in the motor trade for many years but things are slow, so considering branching out into something that might encompass my abilities and equipment. I have always liked signs.
My Uncle a few States away seems to do quite well from the industry. I intend tapping into his knowledge but I am sure there is more that many here may help with.
I was considering this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-44-SignMaker...t_10787wt_1139
Wondering... Is it any good? Is it entry level? How long should this last in a growth curve?
I make a lot of signs for internal use, hopefully it be good for that and the start of what no doubt will be a steep learning curve.
Also - any suggestions as to whether can I use Illustator successfully as my design program? Alternative suggestions?
I am also considering FlexiSign Vinyl Express LXi Apprentice Software. Hopefully this will allow me to do a lot of cool designs for potential customers.
I also realise that garbage in is garbage out so I have a lot to learn not just in cutting, but the design process.
Any help / suggestions would certainly be appreciated.
Ben
Hope this helps SOMEONE - ANYONE...LOL
Cheers - G
Bigdawg
Just Me
Andrew - I see that Fred has addressed your gripes so I won't reiterate what he already said except to say that you have no clue what goes on behind the scenes. Fred works HARD to keep this site focused on professional sign-makers only. So when someone DOES make it through the membership process that shouldn't.. I feel no compulsion to welcome them with open arms into our community.
You felt the need to chastise Fred (and myself since I apparently dropped everything and ran over to this thread to bash the newbie) for posting. Too bad. I will treat the next person that sneaks in the same way - Fred has been VERY generous in allowing the OP to stay on the board. I think that says more about the way he handles things than anything else... a light hand and a minimum of censorship. Signs 101 wouldn't be what it is today if Fred hadn't taken the site over - it would be another piece-of-crap sign board where no professional will post because of the plethora of non-professionals.
I personally haven't given anyone an infraction on this board... if you rise to the level I think you need an infraction - I've probably got other issues with you too that are necessary to address. But how exactly did that infraction hurt you? You were still allowed to post. You were still allowed to do everything on the site you could before your infraction - basically all that did was give you a heads-up that an admin was concerned with your post. So while you may not have deserved the one you got... it really didn't impact you in any way? Did it?
And I disagree. Apparently you do (or did) need some education on how things work here. I'm glad Fred addressed that with you in the public manner he did so others can learn from it. I have no bad feelings toward you at all... but if the site has become so intolerable to you that you just can't stand it anymore, my only suggestion would be to find another one that's run better, has better advice and will allow non-signmakers into the mix.
And before you climb back on that high horse... remember that you have every right to post what you want within the rules without fear of censorship... but we have that same right to address our concerns in an open forum. As I said, you have no idea what goes on behind the scenes... because the majority of negative interactions are taken care of that way. However that doesn't mean we can't make our point in a more public way too that educates others on the rules of the board when necessary.
You felt the need to chastise Fred (and myself since I apparently dropped everything and ran over to this thread to bash the newbie) for posting. Too bad. I will treat the next person that sneaks in the same way - Fred has been VERY generous in allowing the OP to stay on the board. I think that says more about the way he handles things than anything else... a light hand and a minimum of censorship. Signs 101 wouldn't be what it is today if Fred hadn't taken the site over - it would be another piece-of-crap sign board where no professional will post because of the plethora of non-professionals.
I personally haven't given anyone an infraction on this board... if you rise to the level I think you need an infraction - I've probably got other issues with you too that are necessary to address. But how exactly did that infraction hurt you? You were still allowed to post. You were still allowed to do everything on the site you could before your infraction - basically all that did was give you a heads-up that an admin was concerned with your post. So while you may not have deserved the one you got... it really didn't impact you in any way? Did it?
And I disagree. Apparently you do (or did) need some education on how things work here. I'm glad Fred addressed that with you in the public manner he did so others can learn from it. I have no bad feelings toward you at all... but if the site has become so intolerable to you that you just can't stand it anymore, my only suggestion would be to find another one that's run better, has better advice and will allow non-signmakers into the mix.
And before you climb back on that high horse... remember that you have every right to post what you want within the rules without fear of censorship... but we have that same right to address our concerns in an open forum. As I said, you have no idea what goes on behind the scenes... because the majority of negative interactions are taken care of that way. However that doesn't mean we can't make our point in a more public way too that educates others on the rules of the board when necessary.
grafixemporium
New Member
I don't understand how you twist my post around into this? I'm the one that got slapped on the wrist for giving Joe Nascar a hard time in the other thread. What makes you think now that I want non-signmakers in the mix? I most certainly don't. Why am I suddenly on a high horse? WTF? I was just trying to point out the glaring discrepany in the way these situations were handled.
Based on Fred's response, it's clear to me now that there was a discrepancy. The admin who slapped my wrist was in the wrong... and he knows that. Unfortunately, nobody bothered to inform me of that. Until now. Oh well.
How did the infraction effect me? It didn't. It did bother me at the time. Like I said, I have made a few friends here. I respect and appreciate many of you and the information on here. The admin threatened to ban me for a seemingly innocent little flame at Joe Nascar.
In the end, it effected Fred in that his wallet is now $50 lighter each year. That's about as much of a statement as I care to make. There was a time when I would have gladly paid 10 times as much or more each year for access to the type of information that is on this forum. Not anymore.
At least now I know it's perfectly ok to go on relentlessy flaming non-signmakers who stumble upon Signs 101 and ask a simple question. Right? That's what you guys are telling me. Right?
Go ahead... flame on. I made my point.
SignManiac
New Member
GFX I wish you would just stfu and stop your whining. All you're doing is keeping this thread alive with your pissing and moaning. Let it go...