Screw you 3M.

[qmr55]

Yes please keep focus that the real enemy here is 3m's www.originalwraps.com division under-cheaping us all.

Under-cheaping the kind of cheap ^^^^^^

 

[CES020]

how is that so hard to grasp.

That's what steered me in that direction. If I misread it, I apologize.

I think there just needs to be a clear focus on the end goal, and if that's the goal, to get them out of the dealerships, that's fine. Otherwise, it'll turn into an occupy wall street deal. You want them to stop, but there's no goal to make them stop, so it'll just flounder around.

It'll be interesting to see if anything changes. Sadly, for every one quality shop with ethics, there are 9 more with low quality and no ethics to fill the void.

 

[GAC05]

Heh,
just noticed the "Similar Threads" suggestions from the v -bulletin app on the bottom.

wayne k
guam usa

 

[TXFB.INS]

Heh,
just noticed the "Similar Threads" suggestions from the v -bulletin app on the bottom.

wayne k
guam usa

NICE

there sure is A LOT OF "SCREWING" on here

 

[ddarlak]

they are free to do so, but thats just bad business on their part as well.

bad for you if you lose out to them, good for them as they need to sell as much as they can to keep the machine rolling.

it's capitalism all the way, cry if you want to, or stop buying their product, or grow big and compete.

i can get behind the train that boycott's their product mainly cuz in the 100 years i've been in this business i quit using them 90 years ago, but the whining is tough to take....

KEEP MAKING A GREAT PRODUCT AND THE CHEAP CHIT WILL FALL BY THE WAY SIDE.

you will find that the undercut artists live in both back yard garages or high end corporate offices, but the great product comes from the signmaker that charges what it's worth plus a little bit more..... and that, in the end is the customer you want.

 

[Scott Reynolds]

Reading this thread it is very apparent that some people just simply accept the fact that they’re getting walked on. They just deal with it in their own way. Then there are other kinds of people who, when somebody pushes them, they will push back. This subject and this forum with the right amount of support can make a difference.

If 3M recognizes a loss in sales that is in the hundreds of thousands or even millions, they will have to factor that into their business model for Original Wraps.

Some will stand, and some will lie down. Signs 101 is a community, if we can’t help and support each other, why are any of us here?

 

[MichaelAlmand]

Reading this thread it is very apparent that some people just simply accept the fact that they’re getting walked on. They just deal with it in their own way. Then there are other kinds of people who, when somebody pushes them, they will push back. This subject and this forum with the right amount of support can make a difference.

If 3M recognizes a loss in sales that is in the hundreds of thousands or even millions, they will have to factor that into their business model for Original Wraps.

Some will stand, and some will lie down. Signs 101 is a community, if we can’t help and support each other, why are any of us here?

 

[Scott Reynolds]

I'm just trying to understand what the objective is. Your goal is what? To make Original Wraps a private company again, breaking their legal bond with 3M? Is that the goal?

You can't win a war if no one knows the goal, and I haven't seen the goal posted yet.

It might not be that complex for some. Maybe its as simple as Adam sleeping better knowing he didn't sharpen the knife that was used to stab him in the back.

3M is developing a business model that will choke out hundreds of shops. That’s very very clear. 3M overcharges for their material, and then steals work from the same people that overpaid for their mediocre material. Why is that so hard to understand?

 

[signage]

3M isn't stealing any ones customers!

They are providing a service at a price the customer likes/wants! If they get a halfa$$ed job and are happy so be it. This is just like all the low ballers, they can have the customers that accept their work and like those prices!

If these customers they are stealing know what a good wrap(job) is like and they care about their business and you give them quality and/or excellent service they will be back!

 

[Typestries]

Regardless of the philosophical debate taking place in this thread, I'm grateful that not only is the double dipping of 3M being exposed, our eyes have been opened to try alternative materials.

So far, 3751 is a superior product.

And, a bigfish wrap kit arrived today. It's being test printed now. Looks like another great alternative.

Thanks to this great community for broadening our horizons!

 

[401Graphics]

3M isn't stealing any ones customers!

They are providing a service at a price the customer likes/wants! If they get a halfa$$ed job and are happy so be it. This is just like all the low ballers, they can have the customers that accept their work and like those prices!

If these customers they are stealing know what a good wrap(job) is like and they care about their business and you give them quality and/or excellent service they will be back!

Did you forget that they arent giving the customer a choice? Its either they get a wrap from OW or they dont get one. Or it affects their warranty on the vehicle.

 

[signage]

Did you forget that they arent giving the customer a choice? Its either they get a wrap from OW or they dont get one. Or it affects their warranty on the vehicle.

The customer can get the wrap done elsewhere, but it will not be rolled into the lease payment!

I do not think you get it, they can have the vehicle wrapped, just not included in the lease price! Or do you know something that I don't?

And Rick you are correct, other materials to try!

How can the wrap effect the warranty? I think you have been given false information!

 

[HulkSmash]

Regardless of the philosophical debate taking place in this thread, I'm grateful that not only is the double dipping of 3M being exposed, our eyes have been opened to try alternative materials.

So far, 3751 is a superior product.

And, a bigfish wrap kit arrived today. It's being test printed now. Looks like another great alternative.

Thanks to this great community for broadening our horizons!

Very true. Oracal 3751 is far superior. It's great stuff.

And sigange, i know you choose not to deal with wraps. that's fine. Yeah, they aren't stealing. They aren't low balling anything. They manufacture the product, and then sell it for next to nothing because they pay next to nothing. For them it's an average day sale. they have no competition, no real overhead like we do. They are also lowering the installers rates and standards of the industry. Demanding that their 3m installer install at a dollar a SF. How do you think that's going to help the industry? All it's doing is making our product less valuable, and what we do less valuable. I refuse to finance their venture in ruining our industry.

 

[mnapuran]

FYI... did 2 wraps this week so far, 1 was done with customer supplied 180cv3 and 1 we did completely in house with 3751RA.

No comparison.... I can't stand the 3M product. This just reinforced that.

 

[Bly]

Basking in the hate emanating from this thread..

30,000 views. Not bad.

 

[lazaros]

3M isn't stealing any ones customers!

They are providing a service at a price the customer likes/wants! If they get a halfa$$ed job and are happy so be it. This is just like all the low ballers, they can have the customers that accept their work and like those prices!

If i understand correctly you are saying that, i create a product which i sell to my retailers (so they can sell it to people and profit), and then i go straight to the customers and giving them a lower price on the same product and thus screwing my retailers!

Smart move...

 

[signage]

If i understand correctly you are saying that, i create a product which i sell to my retailers (so they can sell it to people and profit), and then i go straight to the customers and giving them a lower price on the same product and thus screwing my retailers!

Smart move...

I never said it was a smart move! All I said is they are not stealing customers! What they are doing is lowering the value of the wraps on a whole. It is not stealing or the moral thing to do, is it a good business plan only time will tell, but I do not agree with what they are doing!

 

[CES020]

It might not be that complex for some. Maybe its as simple as Adam sleeping better knowing he didn't sharpen the knife that was used to stab him in the back.

3M is developing a business model that will choke out hundreds of shops. That’s very very clear. 3M overcharges for their material, and then steals work from the same people that overpaid for their mediocre material. Why is that so hard to understand?

It's not hard to understand. I never said it was hard to understand. I said I'm trying to understand what the goal is. There's a lot of anger, justified, at their business model, but if there's no objective, other than stop using 3M products, my opinion is that that isn't going to stop the Original Wraps program.

If you think 1% of sign shops not buying 3M products is going to stop their $100 M+ business, you're insane. My question was asked in order to better understand if there was a unified, larger objective, an objective that you could hang your hat on, knowing clearly the plan had succeeded.

Colorado said the goal was to shut the program down, which, to me, is about as clear as it gets.

 

[CheapVehicleWrap]

The program will shut down all on it's own. Some of us would like to help push that date a tad closer to the present for the good of all mankind.

 

[CheapVehicleWrap]

Very true. Oracal 3751 is far superior. It's great stuff.

And sigange, i know you choose not to deal with wraps. that's fine. Yeah, they aren't stealing. They aren't low balling anything. They manufacture the product, and then sell it for next to nothing because they pay next to nothing. For them it's an average day sale. they have no competition, no real overhead like we do. They are also lowering the installers rates and standards of the industry. Demanding that their 3m installer install at a dollar a SF. How do you think that's going to help the industry? All it's doing is making our product less valuable, and what we do less valuable. I refuse to finance their venture in ruining our industry.